KJ

[BottlesOf]

Sweet table, no indiv. reads yet.

I get K /images/graemlins/spade.gif J /images/graemlins/heart.gif in the CO.

Folds to MP1 who open limps, MP2 limps, MP3 folds, I raise, button folds, blinds and limpers call.

Flop (<10 SBs) A /images/graemlins/spade.gif T /images/graemlins/heart.gif K /images/graemlins/club.gif

SB checks, BB checks, MP1 bets, everyone calls.

Turn (<7.5 BB's) [A /images/graemlins/spade.gif T /images/graemlins/heart.gif K /images/graemlins/club.gif] T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

SB checks, BB checks, MP1 bets, everyone calls.

River (<12.5 BB's) [A /images/graemlins/spade.gif T /images/graemlins/heart.gif K /images/graemlins/club.gif T /images/graemlins/diamond.gif] Q /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

SB checks, BB checks, MP1 checks, MP2 bets, I call, SB calls, BB folds, MP1 calls.

What do you think?

[Rubeskies]

Is this preflop raise standard? Because I certainly haven't been doing it with no reads.

[sthief09]

perfetto

[sublime]

JBB-

I dont raise this preflop. but i do raise KQ so if its a mistake it cant be a big one. that being said, KJ is a boderline hand and i really dont want to be in a large multiway pot with it.

why not raise the flop?

[BottlesOf]

You mean c/r the flop? What does this accomplish here?

[sublime]

c/r the flop? you are in the CO

[BottlesOf]

Standard? I dunno, two limpers can go either way, but I get a chance to buy the button, and the two limpers are MP and probably weak. I'm fairly aggressive. I think it's good here.

[BottlesOf]

DOH! Ok, what does raising here accomplish?

[sublime]

protects your hand(your J outs) and hopefully gives you options on the turn.

[Trix]

I would have raised on the button aswell, so obviously like this.

A flopraise can do lots of good stuff here, folding either Qs or Js is nice and you may get checked to on the turn. However it will suck alot to get 3bet, so I guess it will depend the MP plays.

[sthief09]

2 MP limpers and you don't raise KJo in the CO?

[BottlesOf]

Interesting... I wasn't sure a gutshot would fold here, especially if they have another piece, but I guess if one of those left to act folds what would otherwise be a split pot, that's great.

Anywho, check out my other hand too /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[sublime]

2 MP limpers and you don't raise KJo in the CO?

not normally no, but with one i always do. weird huh? i dont have specific reasons for it, but if one weak ass limps i will raise with it but if its two i get gun shy. OTOH i raise KJs no problem from any position /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[BottlesOf]

Try raising in this spot, if you think it'll buy you the button. It feels good.

[sublime]

Interesting... I wasn't sure a gutshot would fold here, especially if they have another piece, but I guess if one of those left to act folds what would otherwise be a split pot, that's great.

most of the time they wont fold i guess, but i would still like to make it incorrect for them to call. plus i am fat and greedy, i want the whole thing /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[BottlesOf]

Yeah, i just didn't think a raise was right, but maybe it is. Cleaning up my chop outs...maybe I should. You are, of course, right, about their calling being a mistake that makes me money.

I figured, my overcard was already there, I probably didn't have the best hand and there wasn't enough reason to chop...

[sublime]

why dont you fcukers come down to foxwoods this weekend?

[BottlesOf]

Hahaha, i just edited the post you replied to, so make sure you see that.

And, uh, we were at FW this summer. When were you last in NYC playing poker? HUH!?!?!? Joe said he planned on coming here by now, so get your asses in gear.

And just so you know, I no longer consider the Pats the best team in the AFC.

[sublime]

And just so you know, I no longer consider the Pats the best team in the AFC.

thats ok, i dont consider the NYY the best in the AL anymore

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
Try raising in this spot, if you think it'll buy you the button. It feels good.

[/ QUOTE ]


Chris also raises JTo in this spot when 2 2+2ers open limp

[BottlesOf]

http://www.ebaumsworld.com/forumfun/misc5.jpg

[BottlesOf]

Nope. You were the only one.

[Clarkmeister]

[ QUOTE ]
perfecto

[/ QUOTE ]

[sublime]

can you really hijack your own thread?

we should ask mason

[BottlesOf]

No I was saying you did. Maybe I did.... /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[BottlesOf]

Ok, I think I like it too, can you help me articulate why calling is prefferable to raising the flop?

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
Nope. You were the only one.

[/ QUOTE ]

ed open limped UTG, I overlimped with A4s, and you raised

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
Ok, I think I like it too, can you help me articulate why calling is prefferable to raising the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]


you're so confused right now. I love it.

[BottlesOf]

I think you're mistaken. I may also be mistaken. I certainly would have reconsidered that raise then.

Regardless, I'm sure you can agree my postflop play on that hand was spectacular.

[joker122]

I think you can fold the turn. You're getting 12.5:1 IF everyone calls and IF no one checkraises. You have 4 outs to broadway but they might very well chop. You have 2 king outs but those also might chop.

edit - 11.5 rather than 12.5

[BottlesOf]

I was waiting for someone to say this. I look forward to the responses.

[Clarkmeister]

You are trailing and you can't hope to knock anyone out or even slow down the action by raising with that board texture. Anyone, and I mean anyone who would call 1 will call 2. Why give it a good chance to go to 3+ bets when you can just take your odds to draw and hopefully keep it at 1 bet?

[BottlesOf]

WORD!

[sthief09]

I think it's fair to give him 4.5 outs. 1.5 for a K and 3 for a Q. then again, that T really screws things up, since a Q could give someone a boat, and someone could easily be check-raising trips. interesting

[sublime]

you're so confused right now. I love it.

lol, i guess i was to. i like clarks reasoning however.

[sthief09]

you weren't confused. Chris was being tugged around in every direction. he had 5 different people telling him different things and trying to understand each

[BottlesOf]

I held the only J. I rule.

[sublime]

i applied wishfull thinking to my flop raise explanation thats for sure.

funny how clark can explain something and it makes sense because you dont have to wrestle with the "i wonder if hes right" crap in your head.