Was I right to muck 8s?

[Harv72b]

This is my first post here, so please go easy on any formatting errors or whatever. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

I started playing seriously about 2 months ago, and have mainly focused on low-limit ring games since. But I do dabble in the occasional cheap tourney, and found myself in this situation in a $5+1 buy-in NLHE tourney on Empire/Party last night:

Blinds are at t150/300, and we've just cracked 30 players remaining, with payouts starting at 20th place. I'm in BB & relatively short-stacked with t2721. However, I can (barely) cover both opponents in this hand.

Reads: UTG has been very consistent in raising to 2xBig Blind with unpaired face cards. I haven't noticed any patterns with the SB.

Hero is dealt 8 /images/graemlins/club.gif 8 /images/graemlins/heart.gif in BB.
UTG raises to 700 (2xBB)
5 folds
SB raises to all in (t1414)
Hero folds
UTG calls 714

I had intended to call the raise from UTG, but when the SB went all in on me I kind of froze at my monitor. I liked my 8s, and I was about 90% sure that I was facing two overcards from UTG, but I had no idea what the SB had. Probably pockets, probably fairly high ones, likely higher than my 8s. What it came down to was, being on the verge of guaranteed money, I shied away from putting half my stack up in what I figured was (at best) a coin flip situation against two opponents. I was positive that UTG would call the all in here, and was proven correct.

Did I make the right fold here? Or can any of you think of a good reason why I should have called, or even re-raised? Thanks. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[LLXC]

Easy fold. Raised and reraised.

[Lloyd]

Definitely a fold here. The only hands I'd play would be AA, KK, and maybe QQ, JJ, AK.

[Harv72b]

Okay guys, about what I figured at the time. I'll share with you the reasons why I second-guessed myself now.

It wasn't so much the flop (9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 8 /images/graemlins/spade.gif ), which caused a huge grimace on my face but which I understand is just one of those random things that happen sometimes. No different than folding 72o & seeing a 727 flop.

It was primarily the hands that UTG & SB showed when the board completed with 5 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif 9 /images/graemlins/heart.gif . UTG turned over KJs (so he probably was just trying to steal the blinds, because I can't imagine another reason to raise from UTG with that hand), while SB turned over...33. They both wound up with two pair 8s & 9s, UTG wins with the K kicker. Or, in other words, I had my read pretty well on with UTG, but missed horribly on SB, and would have entered the 3-way hand as a slight favorite even without that perfect flop.

I do feel a little better knowing that at least two other people think I made the right fold. Wound up finishing 15th in the tourney for a modest $4 profit, but I can't help but think how much higher I might have gone had I tripled up on that hand (and I can just about guarantee that I could've gotten UTG all in as well at some point).

[ligastar]

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Wound up finishing 15th in the tourney for a modest $4 profit

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Good for you. These low buy-in MTT is a good way to get tournament experience on the cheap.

Greg H.

[Lloyd]

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Wound up finishing 15th in the tourney for a modest $4 profit

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Good for you. These low buy-in MTT is a good way to get tournament experience on the cheap.

Greg H.

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Just make sure that when you move up to larger buy-in tournaments that you understand that the play will be different and you'll have to adjust.

[Harv72b]

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Just make sure that when you move up to larger buy-in tournaments that you understand that the play will be different and you'll have to adjust.

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Understood. /images/graemlins/smile.gif Like I said, I mainly focus on ring games & don't see that changing in the future, but these NL MTT & SNGs can be fun. I've gone as "high" as a $30+3 buy-in before, but mainly stick to the cheap ones where I can gain experience at NL & can easily make up my entry cost when I do go out early.

[Rushmore]

Harv,

One thing that you want to know is that tournament poker is freakin crazy now. No way do good players make plays like these (As you ask, why raise utg with KJs?? Also, why push with 33 from the sb? It's indefensible; when the board has two pair on it and you lose to two pair/king kicker, who ya gonna blame?). The question you need to ask is whether this is because you're playing low buyin MTT's.

Well, the answer is yes and no. I have seen more WPT-induced tragically bad play in the Stars bigger tourneys ($200, $500, $650 satellites) and the UB $500 lately than I can believe.

More dead money? Sure. More insane/kooky/crazy suckouts and head-scratching showdowns? You bet.

I don't know. I think many of these people don't realize that the WPT broadcasts are edited, and that Gus Hanson doesn't push his small pocket pairs or bluff EVERY SINGLE HAND.

I can't tell if this is good or bad.

I imagine it's good.

Good luck.

[zaxx19]

Im really trying to understand why this is a hard muck?? Yu definitely almost never wanna go 3 ways with 88, thats including final table play....

best case scenario is AK AQ AJ or some combination of the two which gives them 8 outs with 5 to come(47% winner here) and even if yu win at that point yur not guarantee anything since yur stack was fairly low.....

I think even a push is probably something yu wanna think abouty a little bit here even with out the interloper moving in basically yur lookin at a 55-45% situation most times but yu can easily be dominated here ....