Almost everything puzzles me about this hand

[stlip]

As a longtime limit player I'm struggling to adapt to NL.


Party 10+1 SNG
Level:3 Blinds(25/50)

6 handed

UTG ( t2747 )
MP ( t898 )
Button( t990 )
SB ( t505 )
<font color="blue">HERO </font> ( t1355 )
BB ( t1505 )


** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO T /images/graemlins/heart.gif T /images/graemlins/spade.gif


UTG <font color="red">raises </font> [150] MP folds HERO (CO) calls, Button folds, SB <font color="red">goes all-in </font> [455], BB folds, UTG calls [355], HERO folds.

Both players turn over AQo.

I didn't raise when I entered the pot because I thought there was no reason to provoke a duel with the big stack. But the hand seemed too good to lay down, as well. When the SB went all in I was disappointed that I didn't get to be the one to call and see if my PP could hold up for a nice pot with no additional risk for me. But maybe that would have been the wrong play anyway.

Was the SB nuts to push and the chip leader a little nuts to call and I did the safe and sensible thing? (No way I should have called, too, right?) Should I have put in an additional raise when I entered the pot precisely to discourage anyone from doing anything crazy because I wanted to see this flop.

Appreciate any insights into what my line should have been and what my two opponents might or might not have done better.

[timprov]

You're in a much better situation to call the second bet than the first one, as UTG's likely to check the hand down if he misses.

I don't like your original cold-call, though. You're not getting good enough odds to play just for set/overpair value. If UTG has been aggressive, I might push at him, but usually I think this is a fold, as you don't really want to be taking a coinflip against the big stack here.

By the time it comes around to you again, though, you're getting 1210/355 or about 3.4 to 1 on your chips. Worst case scenario (apart from one of them having the other TT) you've got almost 20% equity, so you have to be pretty darn sure one of them has an overpair to fold.

[tigerite]

I'd re-raise to 450, 2x the pot. No way am I laying down TT 6-handed, when I'm far from guaranteed easy passage to the last 3 (barely more chips than the others below me anyway). If SB then calls, fine.

[stlip]

That's a good point about an overcall in NL after someone is all-in that I wasn't factoring in about how there's not so much incentive for two remaining players to start building a side pot and jockey over it.

What I was thinking is that if I was SB I might be holding something more than just an ordinary push hand -- something I expected to win fairly often at showdown -- because I wouldn't expect players with adequate stacks who've already each put in 3BB to fold and let me steal these chips.

But that wasn't my main concern because TT is stronger than average for calling a push, too.

What did concern me was that I thought UTG, who had been kind of sitting on his chip hoard, wanted to stay in the middle of this one and not just let two opponents get one or the other in deeper trouble. I thought that might point to 99+ or AK.

So, I ran a quick simulation against a range of just slightly better than average push hands. Head up I can beat those nearly 60-40. But add another person into the pot with strictly a Sklansky group 1 or 2 hand and my TTs only win that about a quarter of the time. So it seems that while the pot odds are OK, what I find hard to like is the number of times I would be left with one of the smallest stacks as we got to the bubble.

Maybe the biggest part of what I'm trying to understand is if I made an error giving one or both of them credit for stronger hands than either of them had.

But also going back to my first bet, do you really think that 6-handed TT is a fold if you can't be the first raiser?

[tigerite]

When I say I'd re-raise to 450, I mean after UTG's raise and before SB even has entered the hand. This is also just below SB's stack so if he raises to the lot, and UTG calls, I can go all over the top of him. If UTG does this to me, it gives me a chance to fold the hand (possibly, depending on my read of him).

[timprov]

[ QUOTE ]

But also going back to my first bet, do you really think that 6-handed TT is a fold if you can't be the first raiser?

[/ QUOTE ]

Not typically. But against an UTG raise, unless from a particularly aggressive payer, you're likely to be a coinflip at best. You have 27BB, which is plenty of chips to not need to double through right now, he's the big stack, and there are short stacks who do need to double up left to act after you. I'm looking for a better spot.

[stlip]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

But also going back to my first bet, do you really think that 6-handed TT is a fold if you can't be the first raiser?

[/ QUOTE ]

Not typically. But against an UTG raise, unless from a particularly aggressive payer...

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks, I do see that, now. The TT was a nice hand to get in this spot, but the big stack UTG raise presents just about the worst-case-scenario for me. I had a good read on the player and he was not using his stack to try to do a lot of bullying. Having more than enough chips to wait for a better opportunity, I'll consider folding and waiting in more of these situations.