JJ problems ... Stars $20 NLHE

[McMelchior]

I bust out of a lot of tournaments by playing too aggressively into dangerous boards or obvious traps. So my latest strategy for getting my MTT ITM up over 10% is to pace myself. But, maybe I'm taking the concept too far?

In last nights Stars $20 NLHE at level 2 I'm dealt JJ on the BB, with 4 limpers to me. This is not a situation where I'd consider a preflop raise - just too many loose callers to have any interest in finding myself out of position on a flop with an overcard. But see what happens:

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|<font color="C00000">saw showdown</font>

MP3 (t1975)
CO (t1360)
Button (t2055)
SB (t1550)
McMelchior (t2125)
UTG (t2280)
UTG+1 (t1360)
MP1 (t1230)
MP2 (t1265)

Preflop: McMelchior is BB with J/images/graemlins/club.gif, J/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
UTG folds, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls t30, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO calls t30, Button calls t30, SB completes, McMelchior checks.

Flop: (t150) J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">SB bets t30</font>, <font color="CC3333">McMelchior raises to t150</font>, MP1 folds, CO folds, Button calls t150, SB folds.

The button has been playing pretty tight postflop (folding to flop bets after calling preflop raises), and I *so* don't like his call. I believe the range of hands he could have called with preflop must include QJ, JT, T9s, T8s, KTs and KQ.

Turn: (t480) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>

What is my move here?

What I did :

McMelchior checks, Button checks.

River: (t480) K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
McMelchior checks, <font color="CC3333">Button bets t270</font>,

Eh? That's a fold, right? I mean, he should fear a T in my hand if he hasn't got it himself, or am I thinking way to far?

I believe my big mistake was not betting the turn (like 2/3 of the pot). Would anyone care to disagree, or have we finally determined I'm a wuss?

Please bring it on - I soo friken clueless here!

Best,

McMelchior (Johan)

[Lurshy]

Got to bet your hand on the turn. You have a set, don't give them a chance to catch up. You are probably far ahead, there is no reason to give a free card for him to catch on a draw.

The 2 on the turn didn't help him unless he picked up a back door flush draw. No reason to fear it, fire away.

I call the bet on the river. Yes, he could have picked up the str8, but you also gave him a license to take a stab at the pot by showing weakness on the turn and river. I didn't add it all up, but I think you are getting 3 to 1 to call with a set. He may have missed, or made 2 pair with the K, and could be the only way he wins is by you folding here.

I don't think he has reason to fear you with a str8. If he put you on a draw, and you made it, you would have bet. Very risky for EP to go for a chk raise on the river. A good play (after checking the turn) may have been for you to bet on the river, and get away from it if he came over the top.

[Lloyd]

I understand your frustration with people calling raises during early levels, but i think you still have to do it with JJ. First of all, you probably have the best hand here. And even though it seems like an overcard ALWAYS comes when we're holding JJ, they truly don't. You want more money in this pot because there is a good chance you are going to win it. Secondly, you want to raise pre-flop to narrow the range of hands someone might have. Without raising, you have no idea what they have making it more difficult for you to play post-flop.

On the flop, you probably have the best hand. Only QQ could be ahead of you and given no pre-flop raises that's probably not a possibility. But there are LOTS of straight possibilities and you have to protect your hand. And because he didn't raise pre-flop, it's possibly that someone limped in with K 10 and has the nut straight. If that's the case, you're going to lose all your money.

Your bet on the flop was fine. Your turn play was not. The turn card was harmless and you have to protect your hand with a pot sized or thereabouts bet. No choice. Automatic. Even with your check on the turn giving him a potential free card straight, I'd call the bet on the river. You showed weakness which is why he could be betting. But in reality, you were weak so there was no chance you were going to call. You gave up this hand on the turn.