10-20 stud at Paradise ...

Hello all,


A week or so ago I posted about my goal of progressing to the 10-20 stud game at paradise and being able to take 1-1.5 U.P.H. out of the game.


One of the replies stated that if I (anyone) could "beat" that game they can most likely beat any stud game spread in any casino.


I found that comment very interesting. Is this a widely held belief? I have not played many hours in the game, but have put in quite a few hours observing, and while I think the quality of play is excellent, I am not sure I would consider what I have observed "world class play".


I by no means intend to say the regular players in this game are not skilled, as I believe I am a long way from being able to win in that game and at that level. I am simply saying that on a high percentage of hands I have observed ( 25-35%?? )I can pick up on at least 1 player involved in play making 1 or 2 fundamental errors. Would that be in line w/the highest spread stud games in B&M casinos?


Any comments welcomed.


Thanks in advance,

Steven James

There are always bad players even in high limit games. Recently, I observed a 40-80 player call an opponent's bet when the opponent had three Jacks on his board. The player didn't not have a reasonable chance of beating trip Jacks.

In a 40-80 game I was in on Sunday, there was a hand contested between two players in which the betting was agressive and the pot was large, though no pairs were showing. Both players appeared to be going for straights or flushes, or had hidden pairs.


On the river, Player A bet $80, Player B raised to $160, and Player A called. Player B showed a pair of deuces, Player A had nothing--yet CALLED an $80 raise. He said he called because he "wanted to see what he had." I'm no expert, but I'm pretty sure thats a raise or fold situation--how can you call with NOTHING? After the showdown, Player A said, "I wish I had a pair of 3's."


Needless to say, I made a lot of money on sunday...

Does this mean that at the higher limits the gap between the best players at the table and the worst players at the table is much greater than at the lower limits?


Does this also mean that there are fewer players that land somewhere in the middle (close to break even)?


If that is so, does that mean that the "turn-over" on the bigger tables is much faster than the mid and lower limit tables? What I mean is will the top 2 or 3 players sit all day, while all others come and go rather quickly?


And if the turnover is much faster, does that mean that players who have the ability to "get a read" on other players rather quickly have a bigger advantage in theses games?


What do you consider the % breakdown of winners losers and break-even players to be?


20% winners, 70% losers and 10% break-even?


All comments welcome.


Thanks in advance,

Steven James

Hi Steven.


I have also heard the comment about if you can beat PP 10/20 $stud then you can win at any limit at any casino. This statement has especially come from bigstu and riverguy.

This statement is simply not true. Of course as some of the other posts shows, you will also find fish in the bigger games as well. Such as 40/80 and 75/150. But most of the time you are up against great/expert players, and unless you are really good such as riverguy (forget bigstu, nothing but ego) you will not make any money at these limits.

The main reason is this: When playing online poker, the difference is not as big between good players and expert players as it would be in live poker.

Would you rather have played heads-up no-limit big bet poker against Stu Ungar Online or in a real casino (forgetting about possible cheat online). I know what my choice would be. Online he would easily win - In Live poker he would totally crush me.....


The Expert players just have a bigger advantage over lesser good players than in online poker


I like to hear Dynasty's comments to this....


Daniel

When playing online poker, the difference is not as big between good players and expert players as it would be in live poker.


Since I don't play online, I really can't give any substantial insight into this.


However, it is logical that the 10-20 game may be especially tough since it is common for that to be the highest online stud game regularly spread. The best players are likely to be found in the highest limit game whether it's 10-20 online or 40-80 at the Mirage.