Suited flop vs King set

[Larimani]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $0.50 BB (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

UTG+1 ($32.05)
UTG+2 ($22.62)
MP1 ($2.05)
Hero ($248.49)
MP3 ($20.20)
CO ($23.35)
Button ($20.15)
SB ($21.10)
BB ($24.50)
UTG ($25.90)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls $0.50, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises to $3</font>, MP3 folds, CO calls $3, Button calls $3, SB folds, BB folds, UTG+1 calls $2.50.

Flop: ($12.75) K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
UTG+1 checks, <font color="CC3333">Hero bets $30</font>, CO folds, Button folds, UTG+1 folds.

Final Pot: $42.75
<font color="green">Main Pot: $12.75, won by Hero.</font>
<font color="green">Pot 2: $30, returned to Hero.</font>

Results in white below: <font color="white">
No showdown. Hero wins $42.75. </font>


Was my raise on the flop correct (to drive out flush draws)... or should I have bet a bit less give a chance for others to make a mistake by calling? how much should I have bet?

Thank you for your comments.

[amoeba]

Just bet pot sized on the flop.

if you bet 30$, only caller is somebody who has the flush already.

[Ben]

Don't overbet the pot like that.

When I see you do that I KNOW you're afraid of the flush and my bluffing reflex starts itchin.

Just pot it.

[schwah]

calling all-in is generally not an effective bluffing tactic

[Larimani]

Sorry, but I'm rooting for someone with a four-flush to call me with the odds am giving him. Am I not?
As the theory of Poker states "everytime your opponent plays differently from the way he would play if he knew your cards, he is making a mistake, and it's profits for you in the long run"
In this case, my opponent if he knew what I had should fold... right?
So basically, by overbetting the pot, am not allowing him to make that mistake. Maybe if I had bet less, but still more than he needs to be able to call with the right odds, then if might have called and made a mistake.
Have I answered my own question ?? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[cornell2005]

just bet around the pot. by doing so, you give yourself a chance for 2 extra sources of revenue.

1. people will attempt to draw to their lone high heart too much and will miss most of the time. they dont have odds to do so but will try anyway. if you overbet like this they wont attmept to draw.
2. you will get paid off big when they hit their flush and you make your full house. the type of player that will call a pot sized bet on a heart draw is not the type of player that will fold when the board pairs. they will usually pay you off, and sometimes they will pay you off big. by betting huge, you lose the chance to turn your hand into a huge winner.

a pot sized bet also induces a bluff more often than a huge overbet, but i dont think its a significant advantage.

[GimmeDaWatch]

[ QUOTE ]
Don't overbet the pot like that.

When I see you do that I KNOW you're afraid of the flush and my bluffing reflex starts itchin.

Just pot it.

[/ QUOTE ]


Its a little hard to bluff, though, when he's putting any caller all-in.

[The4thFilm]

How long did it take to get that stack?

[SpaceAce]

[ QUOTE ]
Sorry, but I'm rooting for someone with a four-flush to call me with the odds am giving him. Am I not?
As the theory of Poker states "everytime your opponent plays differently from the way he would play if he knew your cards, he is making a mistake, and it's profits for you in the long run"
In this case, my opponent if he knew what I had should fold... right?
So basically, by overbetting the pot, am not allowing him to make that mistake. Maybe if I had bet less, but still more than he needs to be able to call with the right odds, then if might have called and made a mistake.
Have I answered my own question ?? /images/graemlins/confused.gif

[/ QUOTE ]

Would you really set your opponent all-in if you could see his cards and what you saw was just a lone heart? What if it wasn't even the Ace? Don't make ridiculous overbets like that or you're going to find yourself only getting called by hands that are kicking your ass.

SpaceAce

[nightlyraver]

Here is the problem with your bet...

If someone DID flop the flush, then they would have called you and you would have needlessly doubled them up. With 4 people seeing the flop, this is a possibility since hands like AKs or AQs would call your pre-flop raise immediately and hands like KQs or QJs would have proper pot odds to see the flop once one of two players cold called the raise. Anyway, besides that first problem, let's say that you were called by A /images/graemlins/heart.gifK /images/graemlins/club.gif or A /images/graemlins/heart.gifQ /images/graemlins/spade.gif, the odds of them hitting the flush on the next card are about 3.5:1 against. Therefore, you should have bet about $10 into the flop and allowed the many loose callers who frequent this table to try and draw out when they have improper odds. Regardless of what falls on the turn, you still may have good odds to draw to a boat (9 outs @ 3.2:1) if it's a heart, or the loose caller may pay you off with 1 less out since a heart of the same rank that falls on the turn will give you the nuts. Next thing to consider is the player that is holding pocket 4's or 5's - these players WILL pay you off since they may very well think that a $10 bet in this spot means you have AK.

Despite my above criticism, your all-in definately caused you to win a decent pot right off the bat by ending it right there...

[elnino12]

"Was my raise on the flop correct (to drive out flush draws)... or should I have bet a bit less give a chance for others to make a mistake by calling? how much should I have bet?"

Ahhhh--don't do that to yourself. Any callers will already have a flush and you will be out $33 because of an unnecessary risk. Bet hard-either the pot or 2/3 the pot and let people know you're sitting pretty, but consistent bets like that will cost you a lot of money. Remember that minimizing losses is just as important, if not more important, than maximizing profits.

[nightlyraver]

I completely disagree with your asertion that any callers will already have the flush. When he bet's $30, then you are correct almost 100% of the time (that's why it was a bad bet). However, if he were to bet less than 1/2 the pot, say $5, then someone w/ AA,AK or maybe even AQ (one being a heart in all cases) would be justified in calling, especially with a pair and a strong flush draw - ESPECIALLY since many bad players would read a $5 bet to indicate that the bettor does not already have the flush. Also bear in mind that the 3 aforementioned holdings are distinct possibilities, since they called a 4x raise pre-flop.

[Sadico]

But what to do if someone raised the bet on flop?