View Full Version : AQo, berate my play so i stop this crap
bleh...
pp 6max $100 ($1/$2)
fold, MP call ($109), i raise to 5 w/ AQo ($490), fold, sb goes 9 ($130), bb calls ($15), i call.
flop Q/images/graemlins/spade.gifJ/images/graemlins/heart.gif4/images/graemlins/heart.gif
SB bets 5, BB all-in, i make it 20, SB makes it 35, i call w/ an audible "[censored]..."
turn 5/images/graemlins/club.gif
check, check.....
river Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif
SB all-in for 88, i call
like i said, complete barf
Sponger15SB
10-22-2004, 01:50 AM
why would that be a barf? that looks like a nice suckout to me.
PS you were suppose to bet the turn so the SB could check raise you all in.
Note: i am drunk so this could be all wrong.
the barf was to the hand in general, i agree, the river was a nice suckout
Chris Daddy Cool
10-22-2004, 03:17 AM
you should fold, but you already knew that.
also it does make a difference whether or not you hold the A /images/graemlins/heart.gif
jfresh
10-22-2004, 04:25 AM
suckout on your opponent's part right? flush on the river?
77rules
10-22-2004, 09:34 AM
Call me stupid, but after SB re raises you on the turn, why do you call? You apparantly suspect that you're up against a flush draw in which case you figure to be a slight favorite, or a trips in which case you're a big dog.
I realise that he's probably not going anywhere with the pot the size it is, but all in is the only way I can see you trying to prevent a suckout. If you're not willing to move in, you should fold.
Wayfare
10-22-2004, 09:41 AM
Why is it that bad? I wouldn't have raised the BB on the flop b/c I don't want to isolate with such a monster -- only a K non heart makes me really unhappy. I wouldn't mind playing a small pot with only a pair and a draw until I hit that draw though.
BTW I know it's the chick from smallville, but your avatar is good looking. The reason I say this is because everytime I read one of your posts, I think of that guy who thought it was really a picture of you and starting hitting on you. /images/graemlins/grin.gif /images/graemlins/blush.gif /images/graemlins/blush.gif
no A/images/graemlins/heart.gif
the re-raise was on the flop, and i called it because at that point i thought he had AA/KK. he basically min-raised pre-flop and min-re-raised the flop. what makes you think he has a flush draw?
i made the raise on the flop to see how he'd react to it, not to charge a flush draw. basically, i raised into a dry side-pot. i don't think he's min-reraising here w/ a flush draw after i do this. imo, he has aa/kk. qq at this point is very improbable (that'd be all 4 Qs). the only hand i'm really hurting against is jj, and am even vs A/images/graemlins/heart.gifK/images/graemlins/heart.gif. i don't put him on the AK though because he's betting more on this flop, it was $5 into $30. since i put him 90% on aa/kk, i consider flush cards + Qs outs for me, hence the call.
i'm not sure why some ppl are assuming sb has a flush draw after so many min-raises. i was pretty content w/ putting him on aa/kk. its typical party players going "me have big pair, me bet small, me raise smallest, me not scary, honest!"
ya, she's hot. i can't believe that moron...
on to the hand, after going through it a couple times i guess it wasn't *that* bad, but i guess i'm just frustrated that 95% of the time i'm wasting an extra $15 by calling that re-raise on the flop. i should have enough discipline to fold. but, since i considered /images/graemlins/heart.gifs outs, i guess the call is ok. i planned on moving in on a /images/graemlins/heart.gif turn or Q. my river call was pretty standard i think, i can't imagine him having a flush given his play.
schwza
10-22-2004, 10:39 AM
[ QUOTE ]
ya, she's hot. i can't believe that moron...
on to the hand, after going through it a couple times i guess it wasn't *that* bad, but i guess i'm just frustrated that 95% of the time i'm wasting an extra $15 by calling that re-raise on the flop. i should have enough discipline to fold. but, since i considered /images/graemlins/heart.gifs outs, i guess the call is ok. i planned on moving in on a /images/graemlins/heart.gif turn or Q. my river call was pretty standard i think, i can't imagine him having a flush given his play.
[/ QUOTE ]
i think the call is ok. you probably have 5 outs to a big hand (only exception is if he has AA - then you have 2 outs and 1 horrible faux-out). and there's some chance you're ahead, although i agree, this looks a lot like AA/KK. a fold is probably better as it's unlikely this guy's gonna play a flush draw real fast with a dry side pot.
my one beef is that you were planning on pushing if a heart hit. you think he's got AA/KK, and he's bad enough to min-raise with it. why on earth would you think he'd muck it just cause you hit your "obvious flush." if he has the A /images/graemlins/heart.gif or K /images/graemlins/heart.gif then he'll definitely call, which is roughly 50% of the time he has AA/KK. i think pushing would be a bad mistake against this competition.
77rules
10-22-2004, 11:24 AM
[ QUOTE ]
the re-raise was on the flop, and i called it because at that point i thought he had AA/KK. he basically min-raised pre-flop and min-re-raised the flop. what makes you think he has a flush draw?
[/ QUOTE ]
If he had AhKh, couldn't he have played it that way? The way I figure it, he gets about 2:1 on his flop re raise, about his odds of completing the flush by the river.
But you put him on a Big Pair, AA - JJ. In any of those cases you're a huge dog. AA or JJ and you only have two outs, QQ is unlikely but if he has it you're drawing dead. KK is the only hand where you have five outs, but if you know he has that hand, then the flop call is + EV (implied odds). Any pair lower than JJ is unlikely.
So I still don't like your call on the flop. You're a dog to pretty much every plausible hand out there, but a bigger dog for most of them.
BTW, what did he have?
I think A/images/graemlins/heart.gifK/images/graemlins/heart.gif would be played a lot faster on the flop than he did, probably all-in instead of min-reraise. I agree I'm a dog, which is why I didn't like my call in the first place. Although in hindsight it was bad thinking, I considered /images/graemlins/heart.gifs outs; given that, my flop call seems to be fine. However, A/images/graemlins/heart.gifA and K/images/graemlins/heart.gifK probably call an all-in, so its all bleh.
Villian has AA and I scoop. I was folding on the turn if he bet. Free cards are fun.
Sponger15SB
10-22-2004, 01:24 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Villian has AA and I scoop. I was folding on the turn if he bet. Free cards are fun.
[/ QUOTE ]
yay! I was correct. well, not like it was that hard anyways...
Then again the guy has to be pretty dumb to go all in on the worst possible river card for him... so he *could* have had anything.
That's exactly what I was thinking lol. Way to get your chips in when the flush draw and TP pairs. Party in my pants!
willie24
10-22-2004, 01:27 PM
[ QUOTE ]
since i put him 90% on aa/kk, i consider flush cards + Qs outs for me, hence the call.
[/ QUOTE ]
you cant consider flush cards outs. not that many players will fold an over-pair like AA or KK in a pot this big to an allin on the turn when the flush card hits (and none of them will if either of their cards is a heart)
schwza
10-22-2004, 01:52 PM
[ QUOTE ]
AA or JJ and you only have two outs
[/ QUOTE ]
you need running cards to catch JJ. a Q gives you trips and villain a boat.
[ QUOTE ]
no A/images/graemlins/heart.gif
[/ QUOTE ][ QUOTE ]
i considered /images/graemlins/heart.gifs outs
[/ QUOTE ]
These are inconsistant.
Also, the fact that you raised the all-in bettor on the flop with potential callers behind you is inconsistant with you being on a flush draw. No way would you raise a flush draw there, unless it included the Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
In any case, I think that his min raise on the flop is consistant with a flush draw. Lot's of players would do that. But, since you said that you put him on AA for the two min raises, it should have been an easy fold on the flop.
JrJordan
10-22-2004, 04:04 PM
I'm surprised no one has made a mention of the preflop call. Perhaps I'm overly tight, but depending on the type of player the villain is, I'd be very likely to lay down AQ to the reraise. I realize it's 6-max so aggression = good play, but what possible hands can he reraise with that you beat? JJ or TT are the most likely ones that you beat, as he's trying to get a read on your hand. AJ would probably cold call. AK, KK, AA are the most likely reraise hands for a decent non LAG player. I'd just save myself the trouble and fold preflop to the reraise.
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