Standard call down?

[CanKid]

SB just sat down. 10/20 B&M

Comments on all streets appreciated, particularly the PF and turn.

2 limpers to me in CO, I smooth call with K /images/graemlins/spade.gifJ /images/graemlins/club.gif, button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: 8 /images/graemlins/spade.gif 9 /images/graemlins/club.gif T /images/graemlins/heart.gif (6 players)
Checked to me, I bet, SB calls, 1 limper calls.

Turn: 7 /images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players)
SB bets, limper folds, I raise, SB 3-bets, I call.

River: 2 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
SB bets, I call.

[astroglide]

folding would be ridiculous with a 2d river. you misused the term "smooth call". that is calling (usually calling a raise) with a powerful hand with the intention of letting more people in or raising a bigger street.

[CanKid]

[ QUOTE ]
folding would be ridiculous with a 2d river. you misused the term "smooth call". that is calling (usually calling a raise) with a powerful hand with the intention of letting more people in or raising a bigger street.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks for clearing that up.

Do you raise the turn?

[astroglide]

yes. the second spade and possibility of a 6 makes it easy. there is no reason to feel bad if you lost to QJ here.

[MrTop]

I don't think that I would have played this any differently.

[elindauer]

Hi CanKid,

There's no other way to play this. The turn is a clear raise as you may well have the best hand and it would be a shame to allow a spade draw, a set, two pair, a bluff, etc to draw out on you cheap. Note that if you are against, say, JT, AJ, etc, you are freerolling.

Call the river and win half the pot most of the time.

Good luck.
Eric

[Senor Choppy]

Online I'd cap the turn 100% of the time b/c of the freeroll. B&M, I think you played it fine.

[bobbyi]

I agree with everyone else that you played this fine and that there was really little room to do anything differently.

Since you asked about pf: The main factor in my decision here would be the range of hands that the limpers could hold. If they are likely to hold terrible hands, especially ones we dominate, like T4o and K2s, then a raise is almost mandatory, in my opinion. If their playing standards are similar to yours or mine, then I would perfer to call. A primary reason for raising is that you hope to buy the button, so if the button is a tight player who is likely to fold even if you limp, then you have less reason to raise. All in all, your call here is certainly fine in general.

[skipc]

pf, i raise with this hand. on the turn, i cap it. on the river, i raise.

[astroglide]

2 spades and non-nut makes this a non-capper for me

[Michael Davis]

A river raise is completely useless. You are just throwing away money.

-Michael

[ripdog]

[ QUOTE ]
A river raise is completely useless. You are just throwing away money.

-Michael

[/ QUOTE ]

How do you put your opponent on QJ (besides the fact that the post title gives the result away)? I think that not re-raising here is pretty weak.

[Michael Davis]

The post title doesn't give the results away.

I don't put my opponent on QJ. There is no virtually no chance my opponent doesn't have a J when he threebets the turn. The best I can do is tie. If he does have a J, QJ is a common hand he might play. I lose sometimes.

You cannot make money raising here. You are firing when the best you can possibly hope for is to split the pot. You make no money when you have the same hand, but you open the door to losing two extra bets every time you lose.

One card straights with four consecutive on the board always have to back down when their missiles get fired back.

-Michael

[ripdog]

Virtually no chance? I'm very new to $10/$20, so I'm inclined to believe you. Still, couldn't he have picked up middle pair
and a flush draw and bet it? I'm used to seeing really poor play against hands like this, with as little as top pair, no kicker going crazy against me. This doesn't happen at $10/$20?

[Michael Davis]

He might bet this, but only raging psychos will threebet without a J on a T987 board. Most reasonable players usually won't threebet with a J.

-Michael

[elindauer]

[ QUOTE ]
pf, i raise with this hand. on the turn, i cap it. on the river, i raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's crazy talk. After you raise the turn, you are strongly indicating a jack. His 3-bet says he's not worried about that. Don't you think it's possible that he has you beat or that he has a jack with a spade draw? The river raise is particularly insane.

The few extra bets you get against maniacs don't compensate for the times you get crushed by the nuts. Well, maybe in the party 15 they do. I'm beginning to see how you have developed this strategy flaw...


my 2 cents.
Eric