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View Full Version : All-in with JJ in the very first hand


hukilai
10-14-2004, 08:36 PM
Party Poker SnG $20+$2.
First hand, I am in MP with JJ.
UTG+1 raises t30, I raise t100, button calls, UTG+1 raises to t160, I push.

Was it stupid?

Allinlife
10-14-2004, 08:49 PM
put your self in UTG's position..what hands would you reraise with UTG position/ no info on other guys?

call that 60 and play for set value.
no need to waste chips when blinds are 5-10

betgo
10-14-2004, 08:55 PM
The tiny reraise is often a tell for a big pair. Why is UTG so eager to reropen the betting and give you a chance to reraise?

betgo
10-14-2004, 08:58 PM
Furthermore, JJ is generally not a strong enough hand to go allin with for 100xBB.

bweiser8311962
10-14-2004, 09:47 PM
In a word, yes. You played one hand, a $22 hand. You got a premium hand, one you may not get the rest of the tournament. I don't think pre-flop anything but AA is worth going all-in with on the first hand. Let someone else be the first to bust out.

Had you hit a jack, though, you look like a genius. I take it you busted out?

Not that I am one to speak, because I misread a big raise and went all-in with 8s against someone I thought was trying to steal the pot. He wasn't. He had aces. Oh well. Live and learn.

zephyr
10-14-2004, 10:14 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I don't think pre-flop anything but AA is worth going all-in with on the first hand

[/ QUOTE ]

I think good arguments could be made for going all in with KK, QQ, JJ, and AK on the first hand in various situations. In this situation however, I think that calling the 60 and seeing the flop is appropriate. What do you do though if you flop an overpair? Playing your hand for set value becomes much more difficult now.

Only my opinion,

Zephyr

bweiser8311962
10-14-2004, 10:26 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I think good arguments could be made for going all in with KK, QQ, JJ, and AK on the first hand in various situations. In this situation however, I think that calling the 60 and seeing the flop is appropriate. What do you do though if you flop an overpair? Playing your hand for set value becomes much more difficult now.



[/ QUOTE ]

I guess my point is, why risk it all in the first hand?

zephyr
10-14-2004, 10:49 PM
[ QUOTE ]
I guess my point is, why risk it all in the first hand?

[/ QUOTE ]

The short answer is reward.

Poker is a game of risk vs. reward. If I can get all-in as a significant favourite (often the case with KK or QQ) then I will take the risk of busting out on the first hand for the reward of doubling up.

hukilai
10-15-2004, 02:36 AM
Though not relevant to the discussion, the raiser had AQs and busted me out with two pairs

KenProspero
10-15-2004, 11:54 AM
[ QUOTE ]
If I can get all-in as a significant favourite (often the case with KK or QQ) then I will take the risk of busting out on the first hand for the reward of doubling up.

[/ QUOTE ]

I mostly play low limit games. In my experience, there are a number of bad players who go all in early. Even with AA, there's a fairly significant chance that I'm busting out early.

Also, my experience is that when someone goes all in with .... say QTo and wins, that person usually doesn't have much of a chance if there are a couple of decent players in the game.

So, and I know I can be criticized for this, I wouldn't go all-in first hand even with AA. Let the idiots knock themselves out. I'm think I have +EV in the 5-7 person game that will result.

wjmooner
10-15-2004, 12:08 PM
[ QUOTE ]
So, and I know I can be criticized for this, I wouldn't go all-in first hand even with AA.

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If you aren't willing to put all your chips in the middle first hand with AA, or even KK, then you shouldn't even be playing poker. This is even more automatic when you play lower limits.

You raise, some fish comes comes over the top of you, are you really going to let him take the pot with QTo and fold AA?

cya
Chris

rjb03
10-15-2004, 12:08 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
If I can get all-in as a significant favourite (often the case with KK or QQ) then I will take the risk of busting out on the first hand for the reward of doubling up.

[/ QUOTE ]

I mostly play low limit games. In my experience, there are a number of bad players who go all in early. Even with AA, there's a fairly significant chance that I'm busting out early.

Also, my experience is that when someone goes all in with .... say QTo and wins, that person usually doesn't have much of a chance if there are a couple of decent players in the game.

So, and I know I can be criticized for this, I wouldn't go all-in first hand even with AA. Let the idiots knock themselves out. I'm think I have +EV in the 5-7 person game that will result.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fold AA and add yourself to that list of idiots.

KenProspero
10-15-2004, 12:35 PM
[ QUOTE ]
Fold AA and add yourself to that list of idiots.

[/ QUOTE ]

Probably so!! However, I'm finding that for me, it's working very well for me, laying very low until it's a smaller game -- admittedly, I have a lot to learn.

Tosh
10-15-2004, 12:53 PM
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Had you hit a jack, though, you look like a genius.

[/ QUOTE ]

Very misguided logic, the results are irrelevant.

Tosh
10-15-2004, 12:55 PM
You should just call the reraise, I don't think you should have reraised in the first place though. You also have some details wrong as a reraise to 160 would be a string bet.