Sanity Check

[durron597]

I think I played this wrong. This is not a bad beat post. AKo on the Button, You have 5130 chips. $20+$2 on PokerRoom. SB Has about 6300 chips, BB has the remaining 3500 or so chips. 300/600 blinds. What's your action and plan for the hand? You've been playing relatively tight but you've had to show down a bad steal or two. You've only open-raised allin once this entire tournament, standard raise is between 2.5x and 2.75xBB.

[SmileyEH]

all in and in my mind its not even close.

-SmileyEH

[housenuts]

ya you gotta go all-in

[durron597]

A smaller [standard] raise is not even an option, given that I hadn't been going allin very much this tournament? Why do you prefer the allin?

[stupidsucker]

I dunno, I almost disagree. When you push with AK do you want a call or do you want the blinds? Against most hands I want them to call. Of course pairs would be the worst, AA and KK being the worst of the worst. You beg them to call you with any ace.

So is this the kind of hand you may want to bet smaller hoping that someone comes over the top for an all in or do you really just want the blinds?

Say you bet about 1500. Thats enough to get most hands out that would fold to an all in as well. I think you might get a few hands like Ax or Kx to come over the top of you.

I guess for me it depends on how the blinds have reacted to things. Most of the time I go all in here. (especially if I have stolen a bit before)

I am not familliar with poker room very much, but I am assuming you are ITM now. If so I dont mind risking all my chips here going for a big lead into HU. So I very well might try to instigate someone to come in with me rather then just buy the blinds. Only 2 hands dominate you and they are going to call your all in anyways. There is a damn good chance anyone with 88-QQ is going to call your all in too. The people that would push over the top with 22-77 are more then likely to call the all in as well.

Just trying to stir things up... thoughts?

[durron597]

I have more thoughts that I will post later (my other reply was just to try to provoke discussion) but:

[ QUOTE ]

I am not familliar with poker room very much, but I am assuming you are ITM now.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yep. Standard 50/30/20 payout, just like party except bigger stacks.

[bismillahno]

[ QUOTE ]
A smaller [standard] raise is not even an option, given that I hadn't been going allin very much this tournament? Why do you prefer the allin?

[/ QUOTE ]

Stupidsuckers line looks fairly good to me.

FWIW, I'd be tempted to raise to 1500, call any reraise, and push any flop that they didn't bet into you with if cold called... Might generate a bit more action than just pushing, and you do have a premium hand. That said, in a tournament, I'd probably have just pushed without thinking about it...


Good to see you at the 20's now.

[housenuts]

well if you're prepared to call any re-raise you could raise to 1500. but it's sketchy waters. what do you do if the flop comes 7TJ and he bets out? you probably gotta fold since you got no fold equity to re-raise him all-in. so that leaves you with 3500 chips. not too bad, but 6200 from stealing the blinds would be a lot nicer.

[mackthefork]

[ QUOTE ]
all in and in my mind its not even close.


[/ QUOTE ]

I disagree, 1500 is my favoured option, the OP had not been pushing in a lot, he will potentially get a poorly timed reraise and get all in with someone as a big favourite or a flip. 1500 will take the blinds a lot of the time and if hes called and misses and someone bets out he still has a playable stack. I'm all for pushing in general but this is an exception in my opinion.

Regards Mack

[wjmooner]

A push isn't bad poker, as seen by the good players who advocate pushing it. You should be willing to commit all of your chips 3 handed with AK. My problem with a push is that you still get called by probably any pair 77 and above, while you don't get action from weaker aces that might reraise you if you make a standard raise.

Those who advocate calling a reraise are way off though. If you get reraised it is an easy push, especially with the blinds at 600 I don't think any reasonable player folds to a Stop and Go.

Chris

[durron597]

Alright. Here are my thoughts on the issue, now that we've got several dissenting opinions on it. Who am I, David Sklansky? Maybe this is Sklansky-ish, except I'm not sure I'm right; I will just post my thoughts.

Raise to 1500:
First I assume that you will call any preflop reraise.

Pros: You are likely to get more action against a dominated hand (Weaker Ace or King). This is very good.
Cons: You are likely to get more action from weaker pocket pairs; perhaps a hand like 55. This isn't all that bad, since you are only a small dog here.
If the SB flat calls and leads out a bad flop for our hand (JT7, as housenuts suggeted), we may have to fold, when we likely could have taken the blinds.

Pushing:
Pros: This play is much safer; since the stacks are so close in size to ours (SB only has 2 BB more than us) they are likelier to fold a wider range of hands.
This decreases the number of small PPs we are likely to see call us (they will view situation an big dog/small favorite), but we will probably see a call from a hand like AQ.
Cons: Fewer dominated aces will call us.
This method is far less likely to stack someone (because they fold more often). With the blinds this big, is taking the blinds all we want out of a hand like AK?
------------------------------------------
stupidsucker, mackthefork and bismillahno: What do you do if the SB flat calls and bets out on a flop with big cards that you miss? Call with a likely 10-outer? What if you only have 6 (possible) outs? (J98 board).

Results: I raised to 1500, and the SB thought for awhile and moved in on me. I beat him into the pot and he had 55. I don't improve and bust. I am OK with that result as the smaller raise encourages action, I just wonder if pushing would have been better in the first place; does he fold it to an allin when he doesn't think there's a chance he can get me to fold? Should I plan my action based on him having on particular hand (obviously not).

I still haven't decided, but I'm starting to think that a push might be better.

[stupidsucker]

Since there is no way to prove it...

I am willing to wager that he would have called your push preflop with 55 as well. Most players can NOT resist calling with any pair once they are ITM. I cant count the number of times I have been called by 22-55 on the bubble or ITM.

Folding on a bad random flop after a Stop N Go is probably the best line. With a J98 board I would fold in a second because even if you hit the A or K the str8 threat is still there.

I agree that this is an iffy situation. Perhaps we need to consult the almighty ICM. Would you personaly come over the top with 55 here if roles were reveresed? What about AQ-AT? KQ?

Perhaps if you could see his 55 a push woulda been better, but you coudlnt see it. If you could see he was holding AJ wouldnt you love the 1500 bet?

I mix this one up.

[durron597]

[ QUOTE ]

I mix this one up.

[/ QUOTE ]

I suppose that when there are two reasonable courses of action to take that are close, the best course is to mix it up in the long run.