What would you do?

I have KJs in a 1-2 PL game and limp in. The game is fairly short-handed, I think 7 players. It is an Ultimate Bet game. Button raises 2$. I call. Flop is j94 with 2 hearts, but I have diamonds. Anyway, I check to him and he bets 5$ into an 11$ pot. I check-raise him the maximum, I think to 28$. He calls. The turn is a 10. I bet just under the full pot, figuring his only possible hand to improve here is a KQh, and that I will find out if he has that from his action. He calls again. Now the river comes and it is not a heart, and is insignificant. I check, figuring my hand is good and he may bluff into this pot in which case I will call instantly. He bets about 30 into about a 150$ pot. I call quickly and he shows 10-10 for a two-out set on the turn....


I am I way off base or his play foolish? Is my play foolish? I mean I know I played KJs and all, for a massive 2$ raise, but in a 7 handed game I will do this everytime. I can only think that he put me on a flush draw and decided to make a "great" call-down into the huge 16$ pot, then got lucky but was still worried about the straight. Anyway, would you have made his call, or my initial raise on the flop? Usually a 2$ button raise means nothing, but...

If I check-raised the max and got called, that would be the last chip I put in the pot. I'd have to be running so good my head was in the clouds to think my hand could win here. Position can kill you and this is one of those situations where if you check the turn and he bets to buy it, you gotta let him buy it.


Try looking at it this way. Don't focus on his play or the two outer on the turn. Replay the hand as if someone else had played it, describing it to you:


"I limp in late position with KJs. The button raises to $3. Flop is J94 two tone, not of my suit. I check-raise the max with top pair, king kicker and get called. The turn is a T making the board J94T with two hearts. I bet the full pot (about $120) and get called."


What are the chances that this hand is good? What are the chances it was good on the flop?


Given your experience in that game, how often do you win the pot after it gets to this point and you're holding the hand you held? I know my answer to that is almost never.


natedogg

In many situations the play would not have been made- but I wanted him in the hand. I suppose he put me on a draw, and had he not hit 1 of two cards on the turn, my bet would have put all the pressure on him to make a tough call. Regardless of what people "may" have, I was quite sure he did not have me beat on the flop. Sure, in most cases I would probably not make this play- but this game was playing like a short-handed game, and I was 90% sure my KJ was good, which it was. You have to push every percieved edge in a short-handed game, because you are playing more hands and betting weaker holdings. Upon reflection, I made him make a big error (calling a pot-sized raise with two outs) that could have gotten even bigger on the turn had the miracle card not hit. As for running good, I lost 500$ worth of pots (actually 2 pots) yesterday in hands I was way ahead, one when I flopped a full house and got drawn out by a higher one on the river, and the second when this guy hit his ten on the turn (though I suppose pot wouldn't have gotten as large had he not). Sure, in many cases when I get to the turn here I am beat, but do not forget who was in the lead when the initial money went in, and I had very good reasons to believe this was the case. My opponent played weak and got lucky- thats it. If the exact situation presents itself again- I will do the same thing- and I will win most of the time. Later in the game I won 140$ pot with middle pair- this illustrates why I think I played the hand correctly and why I had to push my top pair. Anyway, when this game gets short-handed you have to get a little out of line at times and call or raise with hands that you wouldn't in a full game. Anyway I'm not going to complain anymore. In retrospect I am glad to know that I made a player chase two outs into a nothing pot. Just hope I see this player again...

Don't get me wrong. I was not saying you were wrong to make a read and go for it. That's how you win big in this game.


When you read your opponent for having nothing or something very weak, your check-raise was the right thing to do. I'm not criticising that part at all.


But once your opponent calls that big check-raise it's time to re-evaluate. Now, he may just be crazy (which was the case this time), or he may have a big ol' hand. In that game, it's often hard to push people off two pair or top pair ace kicker or something, but they tend to go into check-and call mode when you raise them. Once he called your raise, you have to shut down.


In this case, your opponent was crazy and unfortunately made a big ol' hand on the turn. But I think you might be being a little results oriented. Your bet on the turn was a little too bold considering the action. The flop check-raise was fine, all part of the game. But once he calls, you are either way ahead or way behind.


I would have check-folded the turn if he's not the ballsy type. And since he didn't re-raise the flop, or even raise on the button with TT preflop, I'm pretty sure he's not the ballsy type.


Not to mention, he might actually be a genius. A check-raise from the cutoff often indicates an attempt to buy the pot from a possible button stealer. So his call with TT may have been brilliant tactics (although in this instance his hand was no good), especially if you'd been betting a lot recently.


If I were on the button and decided to make that call, it would be with the intention of betting the turn no matter what if you check. If a heart comes and you bet, I'm going to fold and if a brick comes and you bet, I'm going to fold. It takes a lot of gumption to fire that turn after someone calls a check-raise, so my odds of being the best hand are low. But if you check, I'm firing and put the decision on you. If you have a jack, so be it, but if you don't have AJ you have to strongly consider laying down.


He happened to catch his two outer and looked like just a fool fishing for a long shot, but maybe not..... (of course, I also assume your moves were based on knowing he was a fish, so this is probably not the case, but just wanted to point out how a player could play his hand exactly the same way for some very good reasons).


Basically, I think your play was fine until you fired the turn, especially since he's probably the kind of player who won't bet a hand that can't beat you there.


natedogg