PP 15/30: ATo on Button

[Levi King]

I'm going to roll this one out street by street, because I think I played it terribly on almost round. All comments greatly appreciated.

PP 15/30 - Reads on the players:
MP2 - new to me, no read
MP3 - LAG pre flop (VPIP 50% and PFR 16%)
CO - Loose (VPIP 35%, PFR% 9%)
SB - About the same as CO
BB - Only slightly tighter and slightly more aggresive than the previous two

Preflop: Hero is Button with T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, CO calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB calls, BB folds, UTG calls, <font color="CC3333">MP2 3-bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">MP3 caps</font>, CO calls, Hero calls, SB calls, UTG calls, MP2 calls.

How do you like my 2B? How much do you hate my call of the cap?

[Steve Giufre]

So far I agree that you stink.

[DeucesUp]

So far it's hideous. I hate the raise and I hate the call of the cap.

How the rest of the hand go, maybe it got better?

[Ulysses]

I think the first raise is fine. I would fold to the cap, though.

[Levi King]

Flop: (25 SB) 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(6 players)</font>
SB checks, UTG checks, <font color="CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">MP3 raises</font>, CO folds, Hero ???

[random]

I hope the river was a jack of clubs.

[risen]

Well you've only got 3 clean outs, and you might end up calling 2 cold twice on the flop, and that is never a good thing. You are almost getting correct odds to hang in there, but I'd suggest you cut your losses and learn your lesson. And Fold to that Cap PF, you've been reduced to hoping for a KQJ flop, and even then you're no lock to win.

[Senor Choppy]

Even if it's capped on the flop between MP2 and MP3 and every other player folds, you're getting a little better than 8-1 to call 4 small bets here.

You need to see the turn.

[astroglide]

I think the first raise is fine. I would fold to the cap, though

me too

[Ulysses]

I call and hope it doesn't get re-raised. When it does, I call again.

[steveyz]

I'd fold. Chances are this ends up getting capped or re-raised. You have 3 clean outs, and even if you hit them, there's a lot of redraws. I'd need more than 8:1 (assuming it's capped) to call.

[cwl]

[ QUOTE ]
I think the first raise is fine. I would fold to the cap, though.

[/ QUOTE ]

how much credit are you giving mp2 and mp3 for having a real hand given this betting sequence? if it had been 3 bet by a blind and then capped by utg then your almost certainly in big trouble. as it is though, i would expect the overlimp/reraise from middle position is gonna be either crap or a decent multiway hand a fair amount of the time.

[Senor Choppy]

You have 2 limp reraisers in this hand. One of them is probably entirely full of crap or having fun with 87s, but one of them probably has KK or AA here. The odds of neither holding a huge hand seems pretty low.

[OrangeHeat]

Get the mouse over the call button, close your eyes, click, and pray for a Jack.

Orange

[Levi King]

Turn: (18.50 BB) J/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, MP3 calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP2 calls, <font color="CC3333">MP3 3-bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero caps</font>, MP2 calls, MP3 calls.

River: (30.50 BB) J/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
MP2 checks, MP3 checks, Hero ???

[risen]

Jeez, Bet and call a raise?

[nykenny]

i don't like the original raise, but however, i think calling 2 cold back is fine.

Kenny

[nykenny]

[ QUOTE ]
I call and hope it doesn't get re-raised. When it does, I call again.

[/ QUOTE ]

i am with Diablo here.

[nykenny]

i am guessing the flop action is that hero calls 2 cold and then MP2 3bets, and MP3 just calls, and hero just calls.

if that's the case, then i would bet. call a raise but not a reraise.

Kenny

[nykenny]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I think the first raise is fine. I would fold to the cap, though.

[/ QUOTE ]

how much credit are you giving mp2 and mp3 for having a real hand given this betting sequence? if it had been 3 bet by a blind and then capped by utg then your almost certainly in big trouble. as it is though, i would expect the overlimp/reraise from middle position is gonna be either crap or a decent multiway hand a fair amount of the time.

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree with you, that's why i like the cold call btf.

but seriously, why raise with ATo on the button after a bunch of limpers? can we be so sure that ATo is a good favorite btf? maybe i say this just because i constantly limp with big hands (like AJo /images/graemlins/shocked.gif) myself...

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
how much credit are you giving mp2 and mp3 for having a real hand given this betting sequence?

[/ QUOTE ]

I echo Senor Choppy's thoughts almost exactly.

[Boris]

The first raise is OK but I would just call. I would not call the cap.

[Levi King]

So, I had Senor Choppy's thoughts in mind when the river came to me checked:

[ QUOTE ]
One of them is probably entirely full of crap or having fun with 87s, but one of them probably has KK or AA here.

[/ QUOTE ]

With the capped turn, I'm sure that one of the guys had KK, QQ, or maybe even JJ and just beat my nut straight. I checked behind.

Final Pot: 30.50 BB
<font color="green">Main Pot: 30.50 BB, between MP2, MP3 and Hero.</font> &gt; Pot won by Hero (30.50 BB).

Results:
MP2 has Qh Kd (two pair, kings and queens).
MP3 has 7s As (one pair, jacks).
Hero has Td Ah (straight, ace high).
Outcome: Hero wins 30.50 BB.

I was floored when I won the ginormous pot, but generally disappointed with my play all around. The good news is (I posted to double check) it sounds like the mistakes were pre-flop and on the river, but my flop and turn plays were decent. Whew, only terrible on half the streets; I guess I'm improving.

Thanks for the critique. More hands to come.

[samdash]

If you're going to play ATo on the button after a lot of limpers you might as well raise. The strategic advantages gained by raising, (free cards later, knocking out blinds) along with you having the best position and a hand that certainly has fair share against these random hands make a raise worth it IMO.

[nykenny]

[ QUOTE ]
If you're going to play ATo on the button after a lot of limpers you might as well raise. The strategic advantages gained by raising, (free cards later, knocking out blinds) along with you having the best position and a hand that certainly has fair share against these random hands make a raise worth it IMO.

[/ QUOTE ]

not much chance to get a free card from that many limpers, and it's hard to knock out the blinds for the same reason.