Playing draws when money is deep...

I'd like some advice on playing draws when the money is deep. Of course this is related to UB micro-no-limit... Often the pots are between 1 and 5 bucks on the flop and you have a 20ish stack.


If you flop a monsterdraw, as a straight-flush draw, you want to get in on the flop and not be facing a large bet on the turn.


Should I check-call my strong draws? Check-raise? Bet?


I'm lost here...


Comments appreciated.


Sincerely, Andreas

First off, if the money is really deep you might not want to get it all in on the flop, even with a 15 outer. However the stacks don't get real large in the microblinds at UB. If a check-raise without overbetting the pot too much will get you in, that's the way too go. If the stacks are deeper, then you should lead at the pot and hope you get raised, then move in. Normally I like to bet my big draws. If you check-raise too often they'll stop betting into you. I believe there is a section on this in Bob Ciaffone's book on pot-limit, no-limit. Might want to check it out.

Position Position Position. With a straight-flush draw, you could make a huge raise if you're in late position, because even if they call or re-raise you back, you have a ton of outs. Not to mention the best part about raising is regardless of what you have, there's always a fairly good chance they'll fold. If you're out of position, you need to make a decision.


Do you want to bet your draw hard and try and get them to lay their cards down, or would you rather try and catch and trap them? If you're going for the trap, check-call. If you want to be the aggressor -- which I think is definitely a superior strategy, as long as you are aggressive quite frequently -- raise them, and bet the turn, and in the event your draw hits, you'll take their entire stack.


There are other considerations, as always: Do they think you're a player who always bets his draws? If that's the case, be wary of the early-position betting strategy, as they will call if they put you on a flush draw. When the board is suit-coordinated, and someone comes out firing, I'm always suspicious that they're simply betting their draw, and have made a lot of money calling them with hands I wouldn't have had that draw not been there.


I can't stress how important position is in all aspects of big bet poker, especially when on a draw. There's no one right way to play these hands, as always, but you're always attempting to get all their chips. Whether you want to get their chips by betting, betting, hitting, and going all in, or by checking, calling, checking, raising, and then going in on the river after you hit, that's your choice.


Know your players, examine your position, and make the decision then and there. Next time, mix it up. Check-call if you were the aggressor last time, jam your cards down their throat if you were meek. Switch gears, and then take all that money they just re-bought for :-)


Max

Underbet the pot on the flop. And underbet again on the turn if you don't hit. Don't take the freecard as it will announce to them that you're on a draw.

Don't like the underbet idea at all. Early position check raise ALLIN. If someone bets $4 reraise him $40 back. You are a favourite over any individual hand but a set (often you are favourite over a made straight eg. 3c6s7s flop You: 8s9s them 4d5d), and will hit your draw almost 60% of the time IF called. Nothing wrong with winning right there and then, and opponents will give you action in the future when you have made hands.


But do get allin on the flop as its too easy for a made hand to set you allin if you miss (you are no longer a favourite with one card to come) and he will dump if you get there.

if your straight flush draw is (for example) eight high, then you really do not have a monster draw.


if it is open-end, then you have ONLY two chances to make it...if some other card comes & makes the flush, you may not want to play with your baby flush.


if the flop gives you 8 or 9 outs to make a hand which is likely to win, then you may want to be aggressive....just remember to varry you play...sometimes try to trap, sometimes be aggressive...that will make it harder for the other guys to put you on a hand

Keep in mind that my comments above apply for headsup situations. Otherwise your flush outs may be dead to a suited A, and you should always be drawing at a nut straight rather than a small one. eg. 4s5s with 6s7sTh flop is not a big draw at all.

It is a drawing hand and I'd treat it as a drawing hand until it becomes either a bluffing hand or a made hand on the river. In the meantime, I'll keep'em guessing on the flop and the turn. From the other guy's point of view, I could be underbetting in order to draw cheap or underbetting with the intention of trapping with a reraise once raised. Both intentions are 50/50 possible. The only way he'd have an easy decision is if he has the highest trips. With any hand less than trips, he's in a bind. Underbetting is my favorite weapon because it has a lot of branches.

i would try to get there as cheaply as possible. underbetting the pot would just leave yourself open to a checkraise against agressive players.


if your players are weak, and can be pushed out of a pot easily, i would bet the flop and it the card doesn't come on the turn, i'd check for a free card.


if it hits, then bet the river, it looks like you're on a bluff and u might be called down w/ some weak holding.


i don't like overplaying, agressively playing draws because i can spot when these plays are making a move with their draws [i don't play internet and i play with the same people over and over] and i'll call 'em down, of course, it depends on the player too.


-alex

It is presupposed from the original poster's post that you are in first position with this hand. Being concerned of getting checkraised by an aggressive player is therefore not an issue here.


I'd underbet the turn for a cheap card. If I just check (hoping he checks along thus giving me a freecard), he might bet an amount big enough to destroy my pot odds. I don't want that to happen.


But by under betting, I might cause him to clamp up if he has something less than trips causing him to just call. I'll also be taking the initiative and possibly give myself a chance to bluff on the river if I missed. If I made it, I'd continue to under bet with the intention creating a "bet-raise-reraise" trap.


Underbetting both the flop and the turn maximizes my unreadableness. It maximizes the number of angles through which I can choose to attack. In no limit, the best offense is the best defense.

[side question] against aggressive players, you hold top pair, top kicker, or top two pair, but there's a flush and/or straight draw on the flop.


you know ur opponent likes to play his draws hard and fast, even raise with them...


assuming all this, would you underbet the flop [say bet half the pot], hoping he pushes all in, or would you rather destroy your opponent's implied odds and overbet the pot, if not bet 2x or more the pot?


of course, you wouldn't dare think of underbetting the pot with top pair, top kicker with several opponents to act and and flush/straight draws out there, especially if your opponents are weak/passive.

If I have top pair top kicker and there's a flush/straight draw with a lot of players in the pot, I usually play it straightforward. That is, I just bet enough to destroy their odds. I don't underbet all the time. I vary my play using as many tricks from the book as possible. But underbetting is a good tool when not overused.