Quick question...

[3rdCheckRaise]

40-80 Borgata
UTG+1 open raises (he is rearly out of line), button and SB call and i call on BB with Q8 /images/graemlins/spade.gif
Flop x x Q rainbow.
I bet . UNTG+1 raises, button folds and SB (fairly reasonable player)3 bets...whats your move?

[mmcd]

Are they aggro or not?

[3rdCheckRaise]

Game is pretty agressive for an East coast game, but LA and Vegas players would call it passive /images/graemlins/grin.gif
UTG+1 is not very agressive but SB is.

[BarronVangorToth]

Invariably, some will call it a weak play, but I don't like calling the bet from the SB because, for all you know, the UTG guy will cap it to try and gain position -- even if you knew that not to be the case, your marginal holding of top pair bad kicker isn't going to be good enough to warrant the action.

In short: I'd say to fold it away, especially since the SB is "fairly reasonable."



Barron Vangor Toth
www.BarronVangorToth.com (http://www.BarronVangorToth.com)

[mmcd]

Here's the problem:

UTG+1's flop raise doesn't necessarily mean a better hand even if he doesn't often get out of line. His raise seems like he wants to play this hand out heads up with position and the lead. It could be a pocket pair smaller than Q's, it could be an AK, or theres a small possibility it could even be a hand like AJ depending on what he puts you on. His raise has the effect of confronting the field w/ a double bet, so its probably unlikely he has a huge hand here.

The sb also wants you out. He might have a hand like QJ or KQ or AQ, but he also might have a hand like 99, 88 or 55.

Is sb likely to 3-bet here w/o a Q?

How much posturing goes on in general on the flop in this game?

Its certainly reasonable to fold, but if you think theres a good enough chance your hand is best here, I like 4-betting to hopefully drop UTG+1 and take on the sb with position and the lead. You'll have a lot of flexibility as to how you play the later streets, and you might even be able to get a free river and showdown if you so desire.

[gamblore99]

With sb's check-3bet, and your lousy kicker I think this a fairly clear fold. If he's a fairly reasonable player than your most definitely behind him. If he has a queen you dead meat, if he has a set your dead meat, if he has a 2 pair your far behind. And there is the possibility that UTG+1 has a legitimate hand this time. Its folding first, with capping a distant 2nd, and calling 3rd.

[na4bart]

Thank you very much. Also, 3rdCheckRaise's comment about the game being passive compared to Vegas and LA games is the key here. Fold.

[elysium]

fold

[3rdCheckRaise]

I folded but so did the original raiser...Looking back betting out was probably not the best line i could pick...