Easy muck for KK? [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

jslag

09-30-2004, 01:56 AM

I should almost always check-n-fold on this flop considering there are two opponents, right? I thought it was a pretty easy muck. I did not take a shot at the pot after both of them called my preflop re-raise.

Should I have re-raised more preflop or perhaps pushed? In retrospect, I think I let them see a flop cheaply. Before the flop though, it was a dream situation considering they both held Aces, just tough that one of the other two flopped.

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (9 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|saw showdown

MP1 ($49)
MP2 ($13)
MP3 ($164.55)
CO ($47)
Button ($45.10)
Hero ($115)
BB ($19.95)
UTG ($43.85)
UTG+1 ($104.10)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif. MP2 posts a blind of $1.
UTG raises to $4, UTG+1 calls $4, MP1 folds, MP2 (poster) folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button folds, Hero raises to $15, BB folds, UTG calls $11, UTG+1 calls $11.

Flop: ($47) 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif, A/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/heart.gif (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $28.85 (All-In), UTG+1 calls $28.85, Hero folds.

Turn: ($104.70) 8/images/graemlins/heart.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: ($104.70) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: $104.70
Main Pot: $104.70, between UTG and UTG+1. > Pot won by UTG+1 ($104.70).

Results in white below: 
UTG has Jc Ad (two pair, aces and eights).
UTG+1 has Qh Ah (two pair, aces and eights).
Outcome: UTG+1 wins $104.70.

Jord4n

09-30-2004, 02:04 AM

yes /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Pokerho

09-30-2004, 02:54 AM

With two callers of a 15x BB *re*-raise, I can't imagine that one of them doesn't have at least one A. I don't think it's a very good call by either of them, but oh well. Good check-fold.

jslag

09-30-2004, 03:30 AM

Agreed. I figured I'm either beat by an A or at worst, 55 or 99.

Piz0wn0reD!!!!!!

09-30-2004, 03:53 AM

I would bet the flop (and prolly fold to a raise). Cant always check when the A flops, heres an example.....

Party Poker Pot-Limit Hold'em, $ BB (10 handed)

UTG ($239.9)
UTG+1 ($212.4)
UTG+2 ($250.4)
Hero ($205.5)
MP2 ($244.2)
MP3 ($398.5)
CO ($398.4)
Button ($174)
SB ($261.3)
BB ($140.3)

Preflop: Hero is MP1 with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif. SB posts a blind of $2.
UTG calls $4, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, Hero raises to $18, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button calls $18, SB (poster) folds, BB calls $14, UTG calls $14.

Flop: ($74) T/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (4 players)
BB checks, UTG checks, Hero bets $35, Button folds, BB folds, UTG folds.

Final Pot: $109
Main Pot: $74, won by Hero.
Pot 2: $35, returned to Hero.

Results in white below: 
No showdown. Hero wins $109.

eagletmr

09-30-2004, 04:08 AM

I agree with this post, people call preflop raises at these small stakes with a lot of crap, and just because an ace flops does not mean one is held. If you don't bet the flop, however, you are practically giving the pot away to a player willing to be agressive and bet.

jslag

09-30-2004, 04:43 AM

Normally I would take a shot at the pot, but in this case I was completely out of position and I have little fold equity to lead out here. UTG only had $28 left behind, the pot is $47, so any sort of weak bet is probably going to get raised or called anyways. Plus there is UTG+1 to act after him.

I also don't see UTG raising in that position without an Ace, KK, or QQ. I'm probably losing unless he has QQ and UTG+1 does not have an Ace.

In late position, if it's checked to me, I'd bet this flop every time. But with all the other factors, I think a muck is in order.

Piz0wn0reD!!!!!!

09-30-2004, 05:07 AM

so..... open fold? yeah, just open fold it.
lol