Flopped an overpair with TT in a 5-way pot

[ilya]

***** Hand History for Game 999132744 *****
30/60 TourneyTexasHTGameTable (NL) (Tournament 6152926) - Tue Sep 28 20:02:22 EDT 2004
Table Table 13872 (Real Money) -- Seat 4 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 1: morongsauce (1505)
Seat 2: mrzarembsky (1590)
Seat 3: jbskoal (855)
Seat 4: dudley304 (710)
Seat 5: mothman142 (495)
Seat 7: hangglider13 (475)
Seat 8: newgirll (1690)
Seat 9: bigonky (660)
Seat 10: ChiTownB (20)
mothman142 posts small blind (15)
hangglider13 posts big blind (30)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to mrzarembsky [ Tc, Ts ]
newgirll folds.
bigonky calls (30)
ChiTownB did not respond in time.
ChiTownB folds.
morongsauce folds.
mrzarembsky calls (30)
jbskoal calls (30)
dudley304 folds.
mothman142 calls (15)
hangglider13 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** : [ 5d, 3d, 8h ]
mothman142 checks.
hangglider13 checks.
bigonky checks.
mrzarembsky bets (150)
jbskoal calls (150)
mothman142 folds.
hangglider13 folds.
bigonky folds.
** Dealing Turn ** : [ Qs ]

Now what?

[michaliv]

I would have probably raised preflop here to 90-120. There is a good chance you have the best hand, but if an overcard comes on the board you could be in trouble. With no overcard on the flop your bet was fine. I think you have to bet out again. If he raises, you can lay it down. There is a chance that he is drawing to a flush, so you don't want to let him draw for free.

[chill888]

I think you must bet the same amount on the turn as on the flop and give up if raised.


There is a very interesting general issue here.

ISSUE:
How much to bet post flop? (assume reasonably early in tourney) when you have a pretty good chance of needing to take another swing (bet) post turn

Assumptions:
- You have a good but not great hand.
- But you want opponent to fold.
- You are not committed to your hand.

I don't know the answer but:

Things to consider:
1. bets must be enough to be believable
2. bets shouldn't diminish in size
3. bets shouldn't be too big to put your stack at risk

A recent "innovation" to my game or learning is to consider/remember that I may need to bet again post turn - while considering how much to bet post flop.

If I bet too much post flop I often regret when i get called and the turn arrives and I'd like to bet without killing my stack.

[tallstack]

I would bet again on this one. IMO, the Q on the turn is not that likely to have helped his hand. I think you are either still ahead or he hit something real hard on the flop here. If you check the turn then you open yourself to giving a free card to beat you, or to being bluffed off the pot. Since you have a large chip advantage here, you have the luxury of being wrong and still surviving with a decent stack. I would either bet about t350 or put him all-in on the turn.

Dave S

[parappa]

[ QUOTE ]
***** Hand History for Game 999132744 *****
30/60 TourneyTexasHTGameTable (NL) (Tournament 6152926) - Tue Sep 28 20:02:22 EDT 2004
Table Table 13872 (Real Money) -- Seat 4 is the button
Total number of players : 9
Seat 1: morongsauce (1505)
Seat 2: mrzarembsky (1590)
Seat 3: jbskoal (855)
Seat 4: dudley304 (710)
Seat 5: mothman142 (495)
Seat 7: hangglider13 (475)
Seat 8: newgirll (1690)
Seat 9: bigonky (660)
Seat 10: ChiTownB (20)
mothman142 posts small blind (15)
hangglider13 posts big blind (30)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to mrzarembsky [ Tc, Ts ]
newgirll folds.
bigonky calls (30)
ChiTownB did not respond in time.
ChiTownB folds.
morongsauce folds.
mrzarembsky calls (30)
jbskoal calls (30)
dudley304 folds.
mothman142 calls (15)
hangglider13 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** : [ 5d, 3d, 8h ]
mothman142 checks.
hangglider13 checks.
bigonky checks.
mrzarembsky bets (150)
jbskoal calls (150)
mothman142 folds.
hangglider13 folds.
bigonky folds.
** Dealing Turn ** : [ Qs ]

Now what?

[/ QUOTE ]

I hate betting the turn here to, but I think you have to. I think the suggestion to bet like 225 or something is reasonable; my only concern with that is that you then have to keep it in mind on later bets so that you're not signalling weakness (i.e. I'd bet my later sets or whatever according to this same schedule for this game only)