How to play AA for max value on party $25 NL

[kurosh]

What's the best way? Half the time when I make a 4x BB raise everyone but 1 or 2 fold and they usually fold to bet on the flop. If I make it less, everyone comes in and I have a good chance of losing. Best option I've seen is to just push out of no where and hope for a caller.

[LokiV]

Hope for late position. Reraise any raise at least pot sized, if enough callers are in by then raise to pot size ($3-4), if reraised you can push all in.

Whatever position you are in, your goal is to go heads up with one person (or two.. but your odds are noticeably worse), and have the pot be large enough for an all in push on the flop.

At this level you will often get called all in by all small pocket pairs and a/k a/q ... hell even a/j a lot.

You'll get some hands where everyone folds but it can make a session to get 1-2 callers.

[PITTM]

i usually just raise it to 3 dollars, and if i get any callers thats cool, but i would like to limit them, and making them pay 3 dollars pf is a good way to do it. if raised before you, just reraise all in and pray he calls.

rj

[Tilt]

On pokerroom 25NL I have seen this regular who always goes all-in with AA or KK no matter what the post situation is. I have seen him do this 5 times, and he has been called all 5 times by smaller hands, twice by two callers. I am starting to think that this is the most profitable play. While most will fold to 4XBB raises there is usually one gambler out there willing to risk his stack on AQo.

[cockandbull]

I think the allin preflop can work very well if you know your table has a few that like to play AQ, AJ and low pocket pairs fast.

[Tilt]

I have wondered about this a lot...so its a worthy topic. Tell me what you all think of this logic.

Lets say that the all in gets called 1/3 of the time in these rooms (but I think that is a low number). Over 300 AA hands, you are what, 89% to win on average when they do call? Assuming $20 per hand, that is net 1560, plus the blinds and small calls when they so not call for a total of around 1750.

Trying it the other way, where you raise 4XBB and get an average of 2 or 3 callers and then make a move. Over 300 hands I think it would look like this:
200 hands: you go all in post flop, no callers, earning ~$6 each time, total 1200
50 hands: you go all in and get called, net winnings of ~ 725 (assuming now a 75% win rate against the callers plus the value of pre-flop callers)
50 hands: You look at the flop and fold or play it more slowly for much less value. net loss of ~75.
Outcome = + 1850

I know this is simplified, not accounting for stack sizes, # players, rake, etc, but my conclusion is that the all-in preflop play with AA is a good one when you believe the table conditions and your table image present A ~33% OR BETTER CHANCE OF GETTING A CALLER. I think that is the case at many 25NL internet tables.

Anyone disagree with this back-of-the-envelope analysis in round terms?

[schwza]

make whatever your standard pre-flop raise is. i like 4xbb as an open raise, 5xbb if there's a limper(s). it's too horrible to give away your hand by varying your pre-flop raise.

[tabish]

[ QUOTE ]
Half the time when I make a 4x BB raise everyone but 1 or 2 fold and they usually fold to bet on the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]
Nothing's wrong with this. With AA, you want to be heads up. Those one or two players aren't going to hit a pair on the flop that often, so they will frequently fold to your post-flop bet. So it goes. It's great to double up with aces, but it's not going to happen every time.

If there's a re-raise pre-flop, or flop action on pretty much anything but a monotone board, go ahead and go all-in. You'll often get called, and in most cases you'll win.

Just going all-in pre-flop with no raises ahead of you is a terrible idea, in my opinion. I've not tried it, but I'd guess that you have a very low likelihood of getting called. Plus, as others mentioned, you're giving away information. That kind of play is likely to be remembered, even by the average unobservant player.