Keeping a good game going.

i thought one of the very interesting comments in ds's tpfap related to where a tournament is paying the last nine players and there are two tables of five left


it is likely that the chip leader at each table can steal the blinds hand after hand because no one wants to risk taking the booby prize


he suggests that, unusually, if the chip leader is on the button with QQ and the player with the shortest stack raises almost all-in the two Queens should probably fold!


why?


because if the chip leader wins the pot the tables are combined and he can no longer run over the game, so it is better to "allow" the short stack to win uncontested to keep him in the game for as long as possible while the chip leader continues to steal the blinds


admittedly, this situation is rather unusual, but i was wondering if the general principle could be used in an ordinary limit game say where there are perhaps two or three weak players who are in every pot and passing money back and forth


rather than trying to maximise every pot that you are in and to bust them out as quickly as possible, when they might leave the table for good, perhaps check or call instead of raise with your nut hands?


make the game fun and not so quickly punishing - maybe when they bust out after a longer time in the game they will be more inclined to think it was bad luck and bring some more cash to the table?


any suggestions along this general line please?

There may be a little more tendancy to avoid coming in the money -1 position like you suggest. But the tendancy of the big stacks to attack the little stacks is NOT unique to that situation; its pretty much true as you get close to the money positions all through until you are heads-up: the money the short stacks have is worth MUCH more than the even-money they can win (that is, t$2000 is NOT worth twice t$1000).


The reason QQ should consider folding is because its nowhere near as powerful a hand when the squeaky tight player raises: there are few hands (if any) he'll raise with that you can beat.


Its true that the lesser players are much more likely to return if they didn't lose so fast last time. But your EV increase associated with their return is pretty small: you may not be there when they get back, they may go to another table, and you and the other 4 solid players each get only 1/5 of the $ the new player loses, which is over and above the amount the player who would have been in their seat would have lost, IF the really bad player wouldn't have come back anyway.


So I'm suggesting that your future EV with this player is routinely much smaller than the EV you can get right now.


Having said that, I can think of one area that MAY piss them off out of proportion to your increased EV. And that is check-raising on the later streets. Some players REALLY get annoyed at it since they feel you are rubbing their noses in it. So if you DO find such player, tend to avoid check-raising her. Him.


Never-the-less, you can act like a gentleman or lady while playing, and be sure not to rub it in when they lose.


- Louie

thank you very much - interesting ideas


just on the QQ thing, to quote ds:


"The gain from playing this hand, perhaps a small bet in ev, is not worth the fact that if you do win the pot, the tables are combined, and you can no longer run over the game.


" ... the nature of tournaments is such that they can occasionally indicate a strategy far different from what you are used to."