Button Raise Question...

[Vagos]

Ok, so I was having a discussion with a fellow 2+2'er. We were discussing raising standards on the button when folded to you.
Consider a standard 10/20 6 max table on Party. You're on the button and it's folded to you. Which hand would you rather raise?
Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif9 /images/graemlins/heart.gif
K /images/graemlins/diamond.gif3 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif
-Andy

[Schneids]

Q9o

[Nate tha' Great]

[ QUOTE ]
Q9o

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree with Schneids.

[Chris Daddy Cool]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with Schneids.

[/ QUOTE ]

ditto.

[fyodor]

This is incredibly close. I too would pick the Q9 for high card value.

After picking I ran them both through Pokerstove vs random hands and Q9 held up 55:44 while K3s was *only* 54:45.

[NLSoldier]

how big does x have to be that youd rather take the Kx than Q9?

[TJD]

Interesting!

Either pocket will have the same chance of 2pr+

Other flops that are "good" are top pair, OESDs and flush draws and ANY pair is good HU in any case.

Q9o will get OESD or top pair+ 4376/19600 = 22.3% and K3s will get flush draw or top pair+ 5213/19600 = 26.5%.

Both will have the same chance of pairing their lower card (16% or so?)

So on the flop K3s is more likely (just) to be happy.

However Q9o has a better chance of missing but having 2 overcards. Is this worth having HU?

The problem for K3s is, just how good is pairing the 3? It is the fact that this lowly pair is overtaken that causes the showdown figure to be lower.

So, we have a choice; would we rather have a greater chance of the flop being kind (K3s) so we can be aggressive and hopefully take it down or a greater chance that we get there eventually?

trevor

[daryn]

ok i'm the guy vagos was in the discussion with. basically he was watching me play and i happened to win a pot with the K /images/graemlins/diamond.gif3 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif.

then he IMs me laughing, .. K3! hahahha..

but i said it's an auto-raise when folded to on the button, no?

[chio]

no autoraise for me

[imitation]

K7s is lowest auto for me

[kiddo]

I play pretty tight with focus on my position. I would raise both from button because I think they will put me on better hands then Q9o and K3s and anyway I am acting last on all streets which is worth a lot in a game where often noone is hit.

[Peter_rus]

Q9o K3s i would muck. K5s is better than Q9o.