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View Full Version : Party 15 - gutshot and overcards, multiway on flop


blockafor
09-22-2004, 11:27 AM
MP3 has been going to war with me for the past 30 minutes. If I bet out the flop, he's going to raise me for sure and the entire field will have to call 2 cold. Should I have bet out the flop?

Party Poker 15/30 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with K/images/graemlins/club.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="666666">2 folds</font>, UTG+2 calls, <font color="666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, MP3 calls, CO calls, <font color="666666">2 folds</font>, BB calls, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: (10.66 SB) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 5/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG+2 checks, Hero checks, <font color="CC3333">MP3 bets</font>, CO calls, BB calls, UTG+2 calls, Hero calls.

sublime
09-22-2004, 12:16 PM
If I bet out the flop, he's going to raise me for sure and the entire field will have to call 2 cold. Should I have bet out the flop?

You just answered your own question.

nepenthe
09-22-2004, 12:41 PM
Well......tell me why you DON'T want him to raise you, or why you DON'T want to thin the field in this situation.

blockafor
09-22-2004, 12:51 PM
Yeah, this one's too easy. How about against an unknown in MP3, would it still be correct to bet out?

Louie Landale
09-22-2004, 01:15 PM
On the plus side:

You have a strong hand that can beat a warring villian unimproved. 2 bets can easily get some hanger-on with a better hand to fold, such as AJ or JT. You can drive folks out that give you more outs (AQ, KJ). You have a good enough draw to warrent getting to the river. You gain a lot of valuable information when the field is faced with 2 bets than with 1. Your draw is better with LESS folks than with MORE. You disguise your hand by betting, give it away by checking and calling. You've got a willing partner who might as well be cheating for you.

On the minus side:

Most of the time you will have to invest an additional 1sb with an inferior hand.

Plusses far outweight the minuses. Bet into him.

- Louie

stoxtrader
09-22-2004, 01:20 PM
vs 5 players with a drawing hand, why bet if not for value, and you dont have value here.

sublime
09-22-2004, 08:51 PM
vs 5 players with a drawing hand, why bet if not for value, and you dont have value here.

"If I bet out the flop, he's going to raise me for sure and the entire field will have to call 2 cold"

Of course this is a huge "read" bet, but if hero estimates that the guy to his right will raise X amount of times, what number do you feel X needs to be?

Chris Daddy Cool
09-22-2004, 09:13 PM
betting this flop is a must for the reasons sublime and louie landale already mentioned