First Night with SSH...Did I play this right?

[Ajax410]

Not sure if I played too aggressive...but with straight and flush draw, I figured I might as well give it a shot.

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (10 handed)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+1 with Q/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG calls, Hero calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls, <font color="CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB calls, BB folds, UTG calls, Hero calls, UTG+2 calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (13 SB) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif, J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(6 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, <font color="CC3333">MP2 3-bets</font>, SB calls, UTG calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero caps</font>, MP2 calls, SB calls, UTG calls.

Turn: (14.50 BB) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, UTG checks, Hero checks, <font color="CC3333">MP2 bets</font>, SB calls, UTG calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="CC3333">MP2 3-bets</font>, SB folds, UTG folds, <font color="CC3333">Hero caps</font>, MP2 calls.

River: (24.50 BB) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP2 calls.

Final Pot: 26.50 BB

[Evan]

i would fold this hand preflop first of all.
Flop raise is totally wrong. You want overcalls here, you have a monster draw. Forcing the field to call 2 cold is not helping you when you want to keep them all in. When it comes back to you 3 bet I like the cap.
You're turn play is just really wierd and wrong, there's no reason to check-raise here since you're straight draw just became succeptable to spliting or even losing. What section form SSH made you play the turn like this?
River is fine.

[Ajax410]

The initial call and the call of the raise both seem correct to me, if I understand SSH correctly - once I made the initial call, I was correct in calling the min raise. I checked the turn because I was worried that by raising...and then possibly getting reraised, I was going to scare the other two away. By check raising, I was hoping to gain a few more dollars from their stacks before forcing them to reevaluate their hands and fold. The 9 falling on the turn only gives me two more outs - the other two 9's, as the Q will put 4 to the straight on the board. So, at this point, I'm thinking that I have 2 more 9's, 4 K's, 4 8's and 7 clubs that aren't K's or 8's, giving me 17 outs that I can bet with confidence. Maybe I get too fancy in trying to check-raise here...but I figured that I have a legit raising opportunity with this hand at this point.

In hindsight, I do think I played the flop too aggressively - I thought so at the time as well - but I'm not sure if those extra bets after the flop really minimized my winnings.

[Evan]

I meant I would fold on my first action, once you limp PF ALWAYS call for one more bet.
Your 9's may not be clean since it's really starting to look like MP2 has JJ or TT. I just really don't like the check-raise since youhad to think it was likely that MP2 would 3 ebt (which he did) and make everyone call 2 cold on the turn (shich will tend to force people of of the pot) when you wnat them in to pay you off on the river.

[Ajax410]

As far as calling pre-flop - that game directly from the hands that Miller feels are playable - early position he has Q9 suited...I didn't deviate from this list the entire session. The more I reflect on it, I find myself agreeing to an extent. Had I just leaned out and bet the turn, I would have gotten re-raised by MP2 and had two players calling 2 bets cold. If I check/call, I will keep two extra players in the pot for the river - but MP2 clearly has reservations about the 3-flush on the board and would probably be check/calling instead of raising. I can see a situation where I might have gotten to 2 or 3-bet the river, which would be +EV with 4 in, but if that situation hadn't occurred, wouldn't I have been losing bets to the pot? Maybe I am looking at this incorrectly.

[DonkeyKong]

it is correct to call with Q9s in a loose game in SSH

Flop: Calm down

Turn: Usually bet out and hope it comes back but in this case, MP2 was the 3-better on the flop so checking to him was a nice move...

what did MP2 have?

[Ajax410]

Results in white:
<font color="white">InfinitiQ45 balance $33.50, lost $4 (folded)
Ajax410 balance $42.50, bet $8, collected $25.50, net +$17.50 [ Qc 9c ] [ a flush, queen high -- Qc,Tc,9c,3c,2c ]
stucontrol balance $17, lost $1 (folded)
c21realtor balance $20.25, lost $1 (folded)
roxyslow balance $13.50, lost $8 [ Kd Td ] [ a pair of tens -- Kd,Jd,Td,Tc,9h ]
B1Dumper balance $20.75, didn't bet (folded)
HappyNSun balance $17.25, didn't bet (folded)
uclaguy balance $24.75, didn't bet (folded)
wizatbiz balance $27.50, lost $4 (folded)
BK101 balance $39, lost $0.50 (folded)
</font>

[Bob T.]

.5/1.00 hands go in the microlimit forum.

But, after one weak limper, I overlimp with this hand.

You had a huge flop, and the flop is a good place for aggression, but I don't think you wanted to be aggressive here, and make it difficult for the rest of the field to come in and give you better odds on your money. If you called, and it was raised behind you a threebet or cap would have been very reasonable.

On the turn, your aggression is misplaced. You don't have as many good outs, and you now only have one card left to draw.

Nice river.

[Evan]

I neglected to look at the limit when I read the hand. At .5/1 this hand is playable (for future reference .5/1 hands go in the micro forum).
You make a valid point on the turn play, but I just wouldn't play it that way. I think I just see more value in keping people in for overcalls if you hit on the river.

[Ajax410]

I agree with everything you say except for the idea that I do not have as many good outs on the turn. Though I clearly would have preferred a card which gave me a straight or flush, I think that the 9 does give me two addition outs (the other 9's), but not the 3 other queens...which would put 4 to a straight on the board. Personally, I never figured the pre-flop raiser for TT or JJ, but that could have just been poor hand-reading on my part.

[Evan]

Wow, put the guy on your buddy list.

[Ajax410]

Sorry for posting it here - will stop doing this in the future.

[Evan]

No problem, it happens all the time. Very interesting hand though, so I'm glad i got to read it.

[tadams]

I agree with everything Evan says except the preflop call. In a Loose Small Stakes Game Q9s is playable from EP.

Do not force the field to face 2 bets cold, you will win more by letting people in to call you when you make your hand. If a player raises in LP after the field has called one bet, I usually still just call hoping the field will too.

Come out betting on the turn. Again you want to trap the field in to calling your bet and then when the player in LP raises I just call letting the field put more money in.

Your objective should be to build as large a pot as possible with this hand that means trying to keep everyone in. You are trying to win a very large pot when you make your flush or straight, which will be more than half the time.

-Tom

[Bob T.]

Your outs to a straight are now more likely to be for a chop, than a win.

[Ajax410]

Touche.

[Evan]

I already said that. /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Ajax410]

I agree with you - except that MP2 - the aggressive player, was acting directly after me following the post-flop betting. This meant that if I bet the turn, and he raised (which presumably he would have done), the other two people still involved in the hand would still be facing a cold call of two bets. The logic behind the check-raise (this would have made more sense had I not been so aggressive following the flop), was to get MP2 to bet, the other two callers to call, a check-raise from me, and 3 more calls - I would then have bet the river, gotten either 3 calls some raising.

Unfortunately, MP2 decided to reraise my reraise...causing the two calling stations...or so I presume...to fold. Maybe I overthought this hand while I was playing it.

[Ajax410]

Touche Again!!! I'm off my game tonight I guess...