Comments on this play??

[kleraudio]

Hello everyone, I was wondering what you guys thought about the play here. This was a $10 dollar party poker 2 table tournament, top 4 are paid, this was the final 6 players.

1) Should i have pushed pre flop?
2) Would a pre flop push have made the CO seat fold?
3) Since i didnt push pre flop, should i have check/folded the flop, bet the flop, or was my push fine??

Thanks in advance for the help everyone.

Jim



Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (6 handed)

Button (t3420)
Hero (t2725)
BB (t3015)
UTG (t2410)
MP (t5450)
CO (t2980)

Preflop: Hero is SB with A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG folds, MP folds, CO calls t200, Button folds, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises to t700</font>, BB folds, CO calls t500.

Flop: (t1600) 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif, 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">Hero bets t2025 (All-In)</font>, CO calls t2025.

Turn: (t5650) 9/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(2 players, 1 all-in)</font>

River: (t5650) 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(2 players, 1 all-in)</font>

Final Pot: t5650
<font color="green">Main Pot: t5650 (t5650), between Hero and CO.</font> &gt; <font color="white">Pot won by CO (t5650).</font>

Results in white below: <font color="white">
CO has Ac 3c (two pair, sixes and threes).
Hero has Ah Kd (one pair, sixes).
Outcome: CO wins t5650. </font>

[Irieguy]

I think your play is fine. The questions begged are:'
1. Should you have raised more preflop?, and
2. Should you have pushed on the flop?

With the chip stacks and blinds where they are, I don't think a preflop push is a bad idea when you have one limper. You'd increase your stack by 20% if CO folds. But, I like making a raise along the lines of what you made a whole lot better. You have some fold equity with your raise, and unless he has a pocket pair, he'll miss the flop at least 2/3 of the time (more if he's duplicating your ace.) Even if he has a pocket pair, you still have 6 outs after the flop... which seems to be plenty against me, at least.

Check-folding is almost certainly wrong after the flop, and you don't have enough chips to play poker with... so I'd push there like you did.

Good play. I'm pretty sure it's the most correct course. Preflop pushing is probably OK too, but I think the hands that would call your smaller preflop raise and fold post-flop give you enough extra value to make your course of action better with a little less variance (higher tournament EV, if not chip EV).

Irieguy

[patrick dicaprio]

when you raise with AK here you have more than 10BB so there is no reason to push here unless it was raised before you, in which case i would expect to be called but hope i wasnt. the CO would probably have folded but that doesnt mean you made the wrong play.

the flop play is poor I think. youmust remember that when you bet all in on this board no one will call unless you are beaten. you have no idea where your opponent is on this board but if he has nothing then you neednt go all in to get him to fold.

Pat

[kleraudio]

I didnt think i was beaten though. since he called that raise, i figured him to have AQ or AJ, since a pp lower than 99 he probably would have folded, and pp 10 and higher he would have reraised. I pushed all in to make him either fold his overcards or call and be a huge dog. Thanks for the help irieguy, i like your views. i didnt think he would have called my raise A3 but thats not the issue. I pushed the flop because if he didnt hit, which i thought he didnt, he would have no choice but to fold or most likely double me up. any other comments by anyone??

Thanks

Jim

[rickthekeg]

What was your impression of this player before this hand? I'm mildly suprised he called post-flop, that play would scream mid pair to me.

[RacersEdge]

I think an interesting point of this hand is whether a pocket pair would fold to the raise amount here. I don't think so in most cases. I think it needs to be higher, but not all in.

[kleraudio]

what do you think a good amount to raise would be if the opponent held a pocket pair, 8's and lower. how about TT or JJ??

Jim

[poboy]

I can't see anything wrong with your play here. Yes he probably would have folded had you pushed, although calling T500 more with his hand is not a very good idea and yet he did that. His call of your post-flop push really surprises me, although he may have figured with your pf raise this flop couldn't have helped you. Without seeing the rest of the tournament it's hard to really reach a conclusion, but I'm wondering if your table image may have had something to do with it. Had you been playing over aggresively up to this point, if so he may have figured you were on a steal attempt. Just a thought...

[kleraudio]

Yes that makes sense, however, i was playing very tight that tourney. I really think that table image does not matter to some of these people online. It was a low buy in tournament. Anyways thanks everyone for the analysis

Jim /images/graemlins/spade.gif

[pshreck]

Key information you need to work with is "This was a $10 dollar party poker 2 table tournament"

His play limping was awful. His play calling the raise preflop was awful. His play calling postflop was awful. You have to adjust your play if you are playing against morons. Raise more preflop to commit yourself to the hand. When you raised just to 700 you are saying 'I am NOT committed to this hand'. This makes the villains call easier.

If you like your raise of 700, then you just check/fold on the flop. Like others have said... you have plenty of chips left to survive in this tourney, and you will only be called by a better hand. If your opponent has QJsuited and draws a Q or J because you didnt bet them out, then so be it, you will still win more often than not if you just check.

[CrisBrown]

Hi kleraudio,

The pot-sized pre-flop raise is fine, but if you're seeing AK as a through ticket here (and that's not unreasonable), why not go ahead and get maximum fold equity pre-flop with a push?

To put it another way, I don't think there's anything wrong with your push at this flop. If you bet the pot, you're left with only 6xBB (six-handed, where only four pay) if he reraises and you muck. That's an ugly situation. Checking this flop screams weakness and sacrifices 25% of your stack when you fold to his all-in bet. Given that it's a $10 SNG at PartyPoker, there's a decent chance your all-in will get called by a weaker Ace or weaker overcards who are "playing a wish" (i.e.: hoping you're bluffing). So yes, this push is fine ... and in fact there aren't a whole lot of flops where you're not going to be willing to push in this spot.

So ... since you're going to be willing to push on almost any flop here, why not go ahead and do it pre-flop, when you can be reasonably sure you're either a big favorite or at worst a small underdog? If he calls with a dominated hand and catches -- as he would have -- oh well. If he mucks, you pick up a T500 pot, which is nice in this spot.

For that reason, I'd have pushed pre-flop.

Cris

[pshreck]

He can show weakness on the flop. It is clear that that opponent is INCREDIBLY weak, because limping at this stage in the tourney is almost always wrong. I doubt the opponent will all of a sudden lead out now unless he it. From my quick read of the villain he likes to call unless he has a made hand. Check down to the riv unless you hit a pair, then value bet.

[reecelights]

I think your preflop bet was fine. But if you were going to push on the flop almost no matter what (what would have scared you off?) you should have pushed preflop. Again I think it is fine to bet the pot preflop, but then check if you miss. Remember, AK is strong hand, but it loses to 22 without improving.

You have already given the impression preflop that you probably have AK, AQ or a mid pair. A push after a conservative bet looks either like a mid-pair, or exactly what you had AK, and a steal.

His play turned out to be bad, but I would have easily put him on a small pair and therefore checked.