KQs in the SB. Poop gets crazy on the turn and river.

[bisonbison]

TA-Tilting? - is a guy I have about a hundred hands with. He's usually decent but seems to be superaggro today. It's only been a couple of orbits, but he posted UTG+1 and seems to be on tilt.
TA-Passive - He's decent but not aggressive postflop w/o a real hand.
LP-A is very loose passive preflop but is capable of postflop aggression.

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K/images/graemlins/spade.gif, Q/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="666666">4 folds</font>, <font color="CC3333">MP2 <font color="purple">(TA-Passive)</font> raises</font>, MP3 <font color="purple">(LP-A)</font> calls, <font color="666666">2 folds</font>, Hero calls, BB <font color="purple">(TA-Tilting?)</font> calls.

Flop: (8 SB) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, J/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
Hero checks, TA-Tilting? checks, <font color="CC3333">TA-Passive bets</font>, LP-A calls, Hero calls, TA-Tilting? calls.

Turn: (6 BB) 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
Hero checks, TA-Tilting? checks, <font color="CC3333">TA-Passive bets</font>, LP-A calls, Hero calls, <font color="CC3333">TA-Tilting? raises</font>, <font color="CC3333">TA-Passive 3-bets</font>, LP-A calls, Hero calls, <font color="CC3333">TA-Tilting? caps</font>, TA-Passive calls, LP-A calls, Hero calls.

River: (22 BB) 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
Hero checks, <font color="CC3333">TA-Tilting? bets</font>, TA-Passive calls, <font color="CC3333">LP-A raises</font>, Hero calls...

[MoreWineII]

That's what we call the Ol' Whip-saw.

[Ralph Wiggum]

I can't put LP-A on any logical hand that he can call the whole way with, but then raise the river, other than either an A /images/graemlins/spade.gif or a 2 /images/graemlins/spade.gif hand. Can this guy call a flop w/ T /images/graemlins/spade.gif9 /images/graemlins/spade.gif in his position? If so, then maybe you've got him, but I think most likely he called the PFR w/ A /images/graemlins/spade.gifX /images/graemlins/spade.gif. The only other idiotic thing I can imagine is that he held a set, and pushed his hand at the last possible moment. My read says you're beat. Call and hope to win 3 bets to 1 on the river, rather than lose 4 bets and possibly knocking out the TA guys.

[sfer]

Since the K /images/graemlins/spade.gif, Q /images/graemlins/spade.gif, and J /images/graemlins/spade.gif are all accounted for, it's hard to believe TA-Passive has the nut flush, especially given the only logical candidate is A /images/graemlins/spade.gifT /images/graemlins/spade.gif and from you read it seems doubtful that he goes beserk on the turn with that hand.

So given that, a possible tilter and an LP, I love my hand and 3-bet the river.

EDIT: D'oh! I misread LP for TA-passive. Disregard this and poop on me.

[bisonbison]

You're misreading the hand. On the river, LoosePassive-Aggressive raises, not TA-Passive.

[WarmonkEd]

ok. I don't like your read descriptions /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

A-P, P-A. Which is it? P or A?

I would've been tempted to raise the river.

[bisonbison]

Dude, it's all explained at the top of the first post. Some people behave differently before and after the flop.

[WarmonkEd]

ah... I understand now

[nepenthe]

I am convinced the calls are all correct, including the one at the river.

[aas]

There are times when thinking too much won't help a lot. You just know that you shouldn't fold. If raising the river is more profitable than calling, it shouldn't be that much more. I call.

[WarmonkEd]

[ QUOTE ]
There are times when thinking too much won't help a lot. You just know that you shouldn't fold. If raising the river is more profitable than calling, it shouldn't be that much more. I call.

[/ QUOTE ]

well the river raise is potentially 3 BB more profitable. I think you'll win enough that the river is a value raise.

[bisonbison]

The flush shows up, two guys who've been calling along start raising and you think I'm going to get anyone with less than a set to call?

[WarmonkEd]

yes

maybe not TA-P, but TA-T and LP-A ain't going anywhere.

[nepenthe]

You must consider the possibility that either of the other two players will call a 3-bet AND/OR that your hand is best, plus any variable permutations thereof, and juxtapose it against the possibility that either of the other two players fold AND/OR you run into a cap by the extremely possible nut flush, plus any variable permutations thereof, compute the profits gained/losses suffered in each scenario and multiply it by your estimated likelihood of each scenario. I say there is a compelling possibility a nut flush is out there.

Going for an overcall here cannot be a bad play.

[WarmonkEd]

[ QUOTE ]
Going for an overcall here cannot be a bad play.

[/ QUOTE ]

alright, I concede to this.

[aas]

You shouldn't only consider your potential rewards. Consider your risks vs. your rewards.

[MoreWineII]

..that I probably grit my teeth, 3-bet, and call the probable cap. It really does look like LPA's got the nuts here but it would suck to miss out on the extra bets if he doesn't.

[bisonbison]

RESULTS:

Everyone calls. 30BB in the pot.

TA-Passive shows Ac3c. 2 pair.
LP-A shows Ts2s. Ten high flush.
TA-Tilting shows 54o. turned straight.

MHIG.

[sthief09]

Post deleted by sthief09

[bisonbison]

I hate your call. He's passive preflop and you're calling the SB in a small pot in a 1/3 structure with KQs?

I can't agree. It's a LP raise so I think folding would be bad, but with a coldcaller already in, I can't get it heads-up by raising.

[sthief09]

I did it again. I didn't realize he open raised so late.

[Luv2DriveTT]

wow.... that is a surprise that LP-A stayed through the turn. After reading the whole hand the only logical hand I could imagine was 4 /images/graemlins/spade.gif5 /images/graemlins/spade.gif. Not that it is really logical to cold-call a raise with such poor pocket cards, but we have all experianced many a player that will play with any pocket suited connectors.

At first I questioned your semi-passive turn play, and I also did not like the check on the river, but when I read your descriptions of each player I think you played the hand flawlessly - take back 100% of my doubts!

Why move the mountain to Mohomed, when you can bring Mohomed to the mountain?

TT in da club /images/graemlins/club.gif

[bisonbison]

Well, I think this may be the biggest pot I've won without ever putting in a bet or raise.

I thought the river was a perfect opportunity for a check-raise.

[Luv2DriveTT]

[ QUOTE ]
I thought the river was a perfect opportunity for a check-raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

Right you are. I never suspect a check raise on the river, it always catches me off guard - and its something I hardly ever do (please forget I said this when you play against me!). This was the perfect opportunity!