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View Full Version : Help Post Flop SnG!


jguy3348
09-13-2004, 11:00 AM
I read this forum and have learned alot. After playing for 6 months I need to ask some basic questions. I am probably too tight and need to become more agressive. I am a winning player. My bank roll is +$1200 playing $1/2 ring games mostly. I am working on my SnG and playing $10+1 on Party.

After 25 games my ROI is $5.30 (small sample).

The question is simple: If shorthanded 3 players and I have TQo..the flop is all undercards say 6 9 2 rainbow. Myguessis that there is a small pair. A marginal bet is made by someone 2x BB. I generally fold because I do not have any part of the flop and I am a wuss?

DoI continue to play this out looking for top player, and do i raise. I am thinking that the other players my have overcards but a pair of T or Q could take the hand down. Also if a K and a bet appears I would fold.

Should I play out to the river if I think it will win the hand or stay tight and fold if I miss on the flop?

Solitare
09-13-2004, 11:34 AM
No hand, no draw, and you lose to any A or K -- Fold.

rybones
09-13-2004, 11:45 AM
I agree with the no hand, no draw, easy fold analysis in general.

However, how did you get in this hand? not that you shouldn't be, but know how you got in makes a difference in how you play it. First, if I am first to act i raise 3xbb with this had as I think it is a winner to only two other random hands. If I get re-raised I fold (ok, I might not if I have the other stack covered by a large amount). If I get called and the flop comes rags as you stated I might try a re-raise depending on my stack size and my opponents stack size. If that gets called or re-raised I shut down.

Now, if I get raised pre-flop befor I have acted with this hand, I need to decide if I am getting bluffed (highly possible 3 handed) or if I am dead. I might fold that is likely the best move. However, I may call to see the flop and then fold to the flop and raise you described. Alternatively, If I have a ton of chips and the raiser is pot committed pre-flop I might push all in pre-flop.

Have I given too many options? I hope this helps and or makes sense. And, of course this is all just mho.

Ryan

chill888
09-13-2004, 12:24 PM
Late tournament raise-stealing is highly profitable in the following situation.

Late in a tourney - say 3 left - with everyone having healthy stacks. Often post flop someone will make a "courtesy" bet - say the size of the BB (or maybe 2x). Often a raise of 3x of the BB or 3x of his bet will get him to quickly release his hand. I especially like the move as it helps "train" the opponent to stop stealling every pot.

Requirements for this type of bluff:
1. Oppponent must be responsible player. That is one who is quite capable of releasing a hand even when he's put a few chips in the pot. Pay attention to his earlier play!

2. You must be a responsible player!! If he reraises your raise steal - you must FOLD. No recalculating of outs and pot odds and garbage like that. If you don't have a big enough stack to make the raise and still have lots left over then this is is a far less desirable play.

3. Texture must be right. Preflop betting and the cards on the flop must make a raise seem plausible. Maybe the two others limped and you are BB. Flop is all small cards. Or you made a small raise preflop and he called and an ace is flopped. etc, etc.

4. Table image. I am tight - so I often have a tight table image (makes sense /images/graemlins/wink.gif ). This play works very well if you have been folding all tourney long. A sudden raise sets off special alarm bells in good responsible players.

The key to any good bluff is plausibility and an escape route (via folding or a few GOOD outs)

gl

rybones
09-13-2004, 01:47 PM
[ QUOTE ]
The key to any good bluff is plausibility and an escape route (via folding or a few GOOD outs)


[/ QUOTE ]

wow, great advice stated in a great way. I often see people bluff (I have certainly never been guilty of this /images/graemlins/wink.gif) when they have no escape plan. Alternatively it is sometimes easy to bluff as you figure you have an escape and then it is called and checked to the river and you have to show that you bluffed on a hand where you had nothing at all. I hate when I do that it completely destroys my table image. I think I will print this and tape it to my computer so that I see it the next time I try to bluff the unbluffable fish.

Thanks chill888,

ryan (rybones)

ps, good to play with you on sundays!!

chill888
09-13-2004, 02:05 PM
Quote; Rybones
ps, good to play with you on sundays!!


Yes, the Sunday game is fun. I keep getting dealt hands that I have lectured others to avoid - so it helps reinforce discipline lol /images/graemlins/smile.gif

poboy
09-13-2004, 08:52 PM
This depends alot on your stack and the other stacks. I'll assume your not short stacked or else you would have pushed pf. If you have alot of chips this is a good place to try and steal a pot. If you get played with I'd throw it away as you're probably up against a made hand. If he just calls your raise I'd check it through and laydown to a river bet unless I hit something.