KK - I just called the river with a FH, too aggressive?

[nepenthe]

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: nepenthe is UTG+1 with K/images/graemlins/spade.gif, K/images/graemlins/club.gif.
UTG folds, <font color="CC3333">nepenthe raises</font>, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button calls, SB folds, BB calls.

Flop: (8.33 SB) 2/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 9/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, <font color="CC3333">nepenthe bets</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="CC3333">Button raises</font>, BB calls, nepenthe calls, MP1 calls.

I put the Button on a flush draw or a PP. There are too many callers, too many. I don't like this and am not prepared to ram/jam.

Turn: (8.16 BB) 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
BB checks, nepenthe checks, MP1 checks, <font color="CC3333">Button bets</font>, BB calls, <font color="CC3333">nepenthe raises</font>, MP1 calls $10 (All-In), Button calls, <font color="CC3333">BB 3-bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">nepenthe caps</font>, Button folds, BB calls.

I am sure the Button will bet again if checked to...I am sure. BB just calls again? I must raise. MP1 is out of the picture and I shouldn't concern myself with him...Button just calls, that's good. BB calls/3-bets, crap. Why did I cap here? There can only be one 9 if at all, and Button is most likely drawing thin or dead.

River: (19.83 BB) A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(3 players, 1 all-in)</font>
<font color="CC3333">BB bets</font>, nepenthe calls.

Final Pot: 21.83 BB
<font color="green">Main Pot: 14.83 BB, between BB, nepenthe and MP1.</font>
<font color="green">Pot 2: 7 BB, between BB and nepenthe.</font>

[nepenthe]

Bump, could use some comments on the flop/turn play. Maybe the river play as well.

[sublime]

I put the Button on a flush draw or a PP. There are too many callers, too many. I don't like this and am not prepared to ram/jam.

I dont get this nep, you should be 3-betting here.

[chawinski]

Yeah if you put him on a draw then make him pay dearly to see any more cards....easy 3-bet.

[nepenthe]

I put the Button on a worse hand, but BB's coldcall of the 2 bets put me on insta-alert and I wanted to see what he does on the turn before going crazy. Of course, the turn card made me think that there was a fair chance a 9 wasn't out there...

[spamuell]

[ QUOTE ]
I put the Button on a worse hand, but BB's coldcall of the 2 bets put me on insta-alert

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah the calling is incredibly scary. I generally like to bet flops and then fold out of the turn before the next card if my opponent calls, they must have a monster.

The BB probably has overcards or a flush draw at best. Yeah, he might have a 9, but I'm not worried about that yet and I'm still threebetting the flop for value.

[ QUOTE ]
the turn card made me think that there was a fair chance a 9 wasn't out there...

[/ QUOTE ]

On the flop, there is a good chance that a 9 isn't out there. On the turn, there is a very high chance. You shouldn't make the results so obvious in your posts.

[nepenthe]

Fancy me this, at what time do you slow down if at all?
There are 3 other players besides me, granted one of them is almost all-in, in a pot that's not so huge, with only one credible draw on the flop, with Button raising and BB coldcalling two. While my lack of a flop 3-bet may be certainly questionable, that this action put me on alert shouldn't be. This is Party 3/6 after all, not 0.5/1. Also, please don't assume the results. Not all things are as obvious as they seem.

[sthief09]

what wasn't clear about BB's check-3-bet following his cold-call on the flop? he said to you, "I HAVE A 9."

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
You shouldn't make the results so obvious in your posts.

[/ QUOTE ]

I think the BB's play made the results obvious.

[spamuell]

[ QUOTE ]
Fancy me this, at what time do you slow down if at all?

[/ QUOTE ]

A bad day to pose me that question (http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=&amp;Number=1006366&amp;page=0&amp;view=expan ded&amp;sb=5&amp;o=14&amp;fpart=#1006366) (You were talking in general, right? We seem to be running into one another more and more frequently regarding our difference in playing style.)

[ QUOTE ]
with only one credible draw on the flop

[/ QUOTE ]

Overcards, flush draw, some very loose players will call this flop with literally any two cards in the hope that hitting a pair on the turn will be enough to win them the pot (do you recognise that line?).

[ QUOTE ]
This is Party 3/6 after all, not 0.5/1.

[/ QUOTE ]

I forgot that more people limped with 9x at 3/6. Or did you just mean that the frequency that 9s are dealt at is higher at 3/6 than at .5/1? I know it's rigged as well but I hadn't managed to work out how yet, you'll have to tell me more about this.

[daveymck]

[ QUOTE ]
Fancy me this, at what time do you slow down if at all?
There are 3 other players besides me, granted one of them is almost all-in, in a pot that's not so huge, with only one credible draw on the flop, with Button raising and BB coldcalling two. While my lack of a flop 3-bet may be certainly questionable, that this action put me on alert shouldn't be. This is Party 3/6 after all, not 0.5/1. Also, please don't assume the results. Not all things are as obvious as they seem.

[/ QUOTE ]

The cap may have won you the hand the button has given up on what looks like overcards (I assume an Ace) either that he had a 2 or a smaller pp.

I think the BB either has a 2 a 9 or a smaller pp than you.

I cant raise the river as I want a showdown for this big pot and dont want to pay 3 bets to see a 9 or ace.

On the flop it may be worth the 3 bet to see how much the button really likes their hand and maybe push them out.

[sthief09]

I agree with nepenthe. with the button almost all-in, he'll essentially always bet the turn.

he still shouldn't have capped the turn

[nepenthe]

What I meant to say was that I think coldcalls on this type of board at 3/6 are generally deserving of more respect than those on 0.5/1. Of course that's not to say that fishes don't abound at this limit.

[spamuell]

[ QUOTE ]
I agree with nepenthe. with the button almost all-in, he'll essentially always bet the turn.

he still shouldn't have capped the turn

[/ QUOTE ]

I haven't said anything about the turn or the river (which I think is a clear call), all I have said is the flop cold-call is not a reason to assume the BB has a 9. I probably wouldn't have even bothered to make this point to other posters as nepenthe was aggressive on the turn, but I just constantly feel like I have to encourage the guy to be less scared.

[nepenthe]

The only sense I can see in capping the turn is to drive out Button in case he was drawing to an A-high flush. Looking back, I don't like it.

[Trix]

You do you want to give him a freebie the times he has the FD ?

Others have said this also, the turn cap is horrid.

[nepenthe]

Opponent won it with a FH.

He had AA.

Let's think about his thought-process for a second here.

He just called preflop. That's idiocy and not worth discussing.

On the flop, he may have been a bit scared by the Button raising and decided his slowplay attempt was shot.

On the turn, when I checkraise and the Button just calls, his fears may have vanished and he didn't put me on a single 9. So he call/3-bet. I capped for whatever reason. He isn't afraid since Button now folded.

River is self-explanatory.

[spamuell]

Thanks for this thread, seriously. I just played a hand which panned out almost identically and I just called the river in it and lost to quads when I had the nut full house. You saved me two BBs and for that, I owe a debt of gratitude, only repayable through me making you lots of BBs by telling you not to be so passive! /images/graemlins/grin.gif