Debatable Party 30+3 PLO8 MTT Play as Chip Leader Late in Tourney [Archive]

GFunk911

09-07-2004, 12:15 AM

I was hoping to get some opinions on my game here. It's a 30+3 Party PLO8 MTT with 210 entrants, paying 30 people. At this point there are 21 people left, so an average stack of 10,000, and I'm the chip leader with 21.5k, with the 2nd stack having around 18. For context, 5 or 10 hands ago, I had bet the pot preflop with a hand I don't recall, with only the Villian calling. He made a small bet on the flop, I came over the top for a little more than half of the pot, and he laid down.

Party Poker Pot-Limit Omaha/8 Tourney, Big Blind is t1000 (7 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|saw showdown

BB (t18219)
UTG (t8108)
MP1 (t8777)
MP2 (t1603)
CO (Villian) (t13064)
Hero (t21388)
SB (t5920)

Preflop: Hero is Button with K/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, CO (Villian) raises to t2000, Hero raises to t7500, SB folds, BB folds, CO (Villian) raises to t13064 (All-In), Hero calls t5564.

Flop: (t27628) 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

Turn: (t27628) Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: (t27628) 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: t27628
Main Pot: t27628 (t27628), between Villian and Hero. > Scooped by Villian (t27628).

What are the thoughts on this play? Specifically:

1. Was I too aggressive coming over the top with Kings and 2 low cards? A constant theme throughout the tournament (for me) was constantly playing to win, not to make the final table, but that may have made me overcompensate and be too aggressive. I didn't like the idea of making a small reraise in that spot, I felt it showed too much weakness behind a raiser.

2. I felt, when he came over the top all in, I was pot committed. Would people have layed it down there? Obviously he is representing aces, but you can't be sure of that, and I still have pot odds with room to spare assuming 100% aces. While it's a tourney and pot odds don't apply in a ring-game fashion, I also can't assume the aces (or is it 99% aces in this situation?).

I feel I have a good grasp on PLO8, I am by no means experienced, having played a limited amount of ring games and SNGs; I believe this way my first PLO8 MTT. I say this only to point out that the "don't risk your MTT on pot odds/coin flips since you are the best player" may not necessarily apply in full.

RangerC

09-07-2004, 03:55 AM

I would almost certainly fold in that spot.

1) The minimum raise in that spot should send off warning signs. Unless I had seen that player make that sort of play with weak hands, I would be inclined to think he has a monster (aces with a better low than yours) and wants action - why else would he make a raise that would likely price the BB into the hand? Even if he's one of those players who overvalues a hand like A23x in PLO8, your Kings aren't a favorite.

2) There are 2 players at this table who can really hurt you. Both have the potential to be involved in this hand (the BB could wake up with aces, even if the first player folds). With so much short money around to attack, getting involved in a huge hand with a hand that is a coinflip at best is questionable.

3) If you raise and get reraised, you're put in a very tough spot:

if he has something like AA25, you have 25% equity and it is 'just barely' correct to call, although in a tournament situation folding is an option here.

if he has AA25 w/diamonds, you have 20% equity and shouldn't call.

if he has dry aces (say, AA7J rainbow), you have 37% equity - clear call, but one you don't like to make in a tournament.

if he is one of the A23x guys, you have around 45-50% equity. About the best situation you can hope for.

I think you have to call the reraise here (but you certainly can't like it), which is a big reason why you shouldn't play in this spot. Since you pot-committed yourself with the raise, you're risking 13K to win 3.5K, because you can't get away from the hand if you get raised. If you were 1st in with the Kings and raised the max, you could get away from the hand if you faced a big reraise, so you'd only be risking your initial bet to win the the blinds (a much better price).

KKxx is probably the most frequently overplayed hand in PLO/PLO8 tournaments. It's the kind of hand I like to attack short money with or make a stand with, not a hand you want to gamble a ton of chips with. You were the chip leader and had plenty of short money to attack - when another big stack made a bet that indicated he wanted action, I would throw that hand away immediately.