Now I'm VERY confused.........

Hi all.


I have for a long time been wondering if the game below was beatable, but I haven't really been getting a clear answer. So I decide to write to Mason Malmulth personally, and below is his opinions on the game, but now i'm more confused than ever.........


here is the game and his opinion on it:


Here is the game converted to US dollars:

Game: 7 Card Stud


Spread Limit: 5$-30$


Ante: 5$


Bring-in: 5 $ (same as Bring-in)


Average pots is about 400-500 $


Rake is like this: The Casino charge 4 % up to the first 200 $, then they charge 2 % of the rest between 200 and 800 $. They don't charge anything at the rest of the pot. Tip is about 1%, unless you win a very small pot.


Mason: It looks like it costs about $20 per pot to play. That's extremely high.


Players are like this:


Often there is 4-5 really bad loose-passive players, and only 1-2 okay players. About 55-60 % of the players go to see 4th street.


Mason: Bad players and the fact that the game is spread limit can make up for part of the high time charge.


1. What if you are a good player (not an expert, ala Phill hellmuth, T.j. Cloutier), is that game worth playing at all ?


Mason: I doubt if either of these two guys can beat any form of limit poker. As far as I know neither one has ever been able to win in side games of any form. I've never played with Cloutier but I have played with Helmuth.


2. If you mean that it is possible to beat, how are you going to attack the game ?


Mason: Generally in spread limit games you want to get pair over pair. Also, with that big rake you need more multiway action than usual and make sure your cards are very live.


I know that you have to play more loose, because of the very very high ante (notice that the ante is exactly, the same as the bring in). I guess that this is very bad for the good players.


Mason:I think the opposite is true.


3. But how more loose do you have to play, maybe an expert can come up with some exsamples ?


Hope you will help me with the question,

Daniel


mason


Now, when he says that either Phil Hellmuth or T.j. Cloutier can beat any form or any kind of side-game, does this mean that you cannot win a playing ring games at all?? I mean if either of these guys can't beat side-games, who can??


Also, Why does Mason say that it is good for good players that the ante is high?? He writes "I think the opposite is true". Dosen't the high ante favor bad players, because it now becomes correct to play a little bit looser on 3 street??


Also what comments do you have of the game above, or his comments??


Any help is appreciated,

Best.

Daniel

Mason isn't saying nobody can beat side games, he's saying that despite their well-earned reputation from tournament poker, these two guys generally don't beat side games. There are many well-known, big-name tournament poker stars who are also known to generally do poorly in side games.


However, I am not expressing any opinion on these two in particular, because I've never played a side game with either of them.


Later, Greg Raymer (FossilMan)

Dear Daniel,


I was wondering where you play. Your description of the game sounds very much like the spread limit stud games they have in most german casinos.


Are you from Germany, and if so, where do you play?


Stephan

only the very best players will win here and only maybe two at the table can be winners. so if you are not in this class or close to it you are boiled hassinfeffer.