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09-12-2001, 07:04 PM
playing in 15-30 game last night. I am not overly talkative at the table but I will engage in a little bit of good natured banter and trash talk if I feel its appropriate. I'm heads up on the turn and when I bet I tell the bad guy "your [name his cards] is no good". He gives me this strange look and calls. turned out I was correct about his cards and he asked for a deck change.


On the one hand I think this move strengthened my table image as it was not a totally obvious read. This is good.


On the other hand I think it may have planted a small seed of suspicion in the guy's mind about the integrity of the game. This is bad.


Should I just keep my mouth shut next time?

09-13-2001, 01:14 AM
I can't imagine he really questions the integrity of the game based on your comment. Nobody playing with marked cards of any kind would say such a thing during the play of a hand, particularly when holding the winning hand. He might have been freaked out you read him so well, and we all know a how a deck change will prevent that from happening. :-)

09-13-2001, 01:53 AM
You are arrogant, Boris. In this forum and at the tables you show your arrogance. Sorry.

09-13-2001, 02:24 AM
I could not disagree more. I've played with Boris in the casinos and in home games and if anything, he is self-effacing. He takes a bad beat well. And in reference to his comments on the forum, I can't imagine where you got that impression. Perhaps you've never read any posts by SmoothB or limon or LastChance.


natedogg

09-13-2001, 06:48 AM

09-13-2001, 09:09 AM
I've played plenty with Boris and read reams of his words. If he is arrogant, then the meaning of that word has changed and we now need a new word to describe those who really are. (Same thing happened with "star," as in music and movies. Then there was "superstar," then there was "megastar.")


Boris,


While I don't engage in this way, I don't think there is anything wrong with it, not even close, and I seriously doubt your opponent doubted the integrity of the game because of your remark. That you would even consider such a thing reveals your 'arrogance.' (I figure as long as we can make up new meanings for old words, I'm defining "arrogant" as "overly considerate.")


Tommy

09-13-2001, 12:29 PM
I've played many hours with Boris as well. He's not arrogant at all.

09-13-2001, 01:06 PM
sometimes I am arrogant but not usually. You should also know that there are several players who use the sign-up name Boris in the Bay area casinos. I am not one of them so maybe you have me confused with some one else. If you really do have me pegged then all I can say is "to know me is to love me". lol

09-13-2001, 01:07 PM
Thanks guys!

09-13-2001, 02:00 PM
unless you have a very specific and thoughtout pshchological reason (meaning you have a plan to take advantage of the comment very soon) why would you ever divulge to your opponent that you know his likely hand, or how he plays his cards? While it's possible there are some reasons, (putting the opponent on tilt, etc,)it's more likely IMO that your comment will merely inspire said opponent to play a better game, as well as the other players at the table.

09-13-2001, 03:28 PM
I agree its totally inapropriate to call someone's hand if you are not involved or there are 3 or more people in the hand.

09-14-2001, 12:11 PM
I totally agree with Hillbilly!


Unless you have a very clearly thought out "agenda", why on earth would you:


a.) Want to let ANY specific player know that you've got that good a read on him?


b.) Why would you want to alert the rest of the players at the table that you are playing at that level?


What possible +EV can come out of it for you?


(Im not being a wise guy here, either, as I can envision a few scenario's where it could be to your advantage to do so...I'd just like to hear your response/rationale for doing it)

09-14-2001, 01:27 PM
I don't think there's anything wrong with what you did at all, although it tells your opponent that your a pretty strong player. That's an edge that could help you in the future, but it could also cost you a few bets.

09-14-2001, 03:01 PM
Well it was kind of an off the cuff remark. My Rational: I like having a strong table image. I think if opponents think you read hands well they are less likely to bluff against you and thus play much more straight forward. several people mentioned that this may motivate people to be more tricky. But is that a bad thing? I think it depends on how they choose to be tricky. If being tricky means playing inferior starting hands then clearly you have gained. being tricky could also mean playing more aggressively after the flop. This may or may not be a mistake depending on the player. IME, people tend to play much more straight forward against a player they perceive as strong.

09-15-2001, 01:42 AM
Ok, who's definition are we going with here? Tommy's or the other one??

09-16-2001, 08:52 AM
Boris,


You've just identified 2 of the reasons that I would agree with. Let me add a 3rd....."To put another player on tilt"


All three of these (and others), however, require that your "reads" on the opposition be very solid and that you are sure that you can motivate your opponents into violating the Fundamental Theory of Poker.


It, of course, is not that simple. IMO, it is crucial that you know what other players at the table are capable (if any) of seeing and understanding what U are doing. If there are, then it's probably best that you take serious notice of them when they 're in a hand that you are contesting!


A strong table image motivates different players to respond in different ways. For example, if one is aware of the general manner in which a weak/tight player vs. a loose/agressive player is likely to respond, then you are really in a position of exerting serious "control" over the table and you have achieved your objective. This requires isolating specific players and picking your spots.....Makes for a challenging exercise!