Two questions from one hand - adjusting from SNG's and player reads [Archive]

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ipp147

09-01-2004, 04:31 PM

Ok, heres a hand from very early in todays session. First the hand then my 2 questions,

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $1 BB (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|saw showdown

MP1 ($30.35)
MP2 ($95.50)
MP3 ($14.35)
CO ($44)
Button ($47.50)
SB ($38.80)
BB ($27.40)
UTG ($51.80)
UTG+1 ($45.25)
Hero ($54)

Preflop: Hero is UTG+2 with Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls $1, Hero calls $1, MP1 calls $1, MP2 calls $1, 2 folds, Button calls $1, SB completes, BB checks,

Flop: ($7) 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (7 players)
SB checks, BB checks, UTG+1 bets $1, Hero calls $1, MP1 raises to $15, MP2 folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB folds, UTG+1 folds, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $24
Main Pot: $10, won by MP1.
Pot 2: $14, returned to MP1.

1. This is an easy fold with no reads right, if I was playing an SNG this is probably a call for me but right here I must fold. Any comments on my preflop-flop call go ahead.

2. Now, a few hands later I get some idea of the sort of player he is. Not so much suicidal, just very aggressive. Raising 8 limpers in the BB with 22 then calling an all in with it, all in on the flop with 3rd nut flush vs multiple opponents. Basically a very aggressive gambler. (As an aside, if someone keeps raising limpers from his blind and you are on button do you keep trashing suited connectors there and save the BB?)

So, armed with this information, do you adjust your play on the hand against him. You are still for all you know just a coin flip, I don't want my money in on coinflips in cash games. Against this sort of player I think I should just wait and trap him? Is this thinking correct or should I adjust the standards with which I would call his all-in with and assume I'm better than a coinflip?

schwza

09-01-2004, 05:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I don't want my money in on coinflips in cash games.

[/ QUOTE ]

ummmm... why not?

as for your hand, with no read, i would probably push. it's pretty rare (i think) to see somebody overbet the pot with a hand like a set - i think it's much more likely to be one pair. and it could be a draw, which is a jackpot for you.

villain has less than 15 left behind, so he'll call with any draw, but may lay down a small pair. and even if he has a set, you're still ~25% to win.

that said, i will probably be flamed for advocating a push here.

ipp147

09-01-2004, 05:14 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't want my money in on coinflips in cash games.

[/ QUOTE ]

ummmm... why not?

[/ QUOTE ]

You know what - I just assumed in cash games I didn't. Like most things I havent't thought it through really. I suppose I prefer a much greater edge as in AA vs another hand preflop, so and so on. I just figured that over 10,000 hands if I get in with coinflips then you I will be, well, even.

I prefer to "know" I have the best of it before getting the bulk of my stack in.

BobboFitos

09-01-2004, 05:27 PM

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't want my money in on coinflips in cash games.

[/ QUOTE ]

ummmm... why not?

as for your hand, with no read, i would probably push. it's pretty rare (i think) to see somebody overbet the pot with a hand like a set - i think it's much more likely to be one pair. and it could be a draw, which is a jackpot for you.

villain has less than 15 left behind, so he'll call with any draw, but may lay down a small pair. and even if he has a set, you're still ~25% to win.

that said, i will probably be flamed for advocating a push here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not going to flame you here... And I love semibluffs even more than the next guy... But you have relatively ZERO folding equity, which is a big reason for semibluffing success. If the overcard outs are live, this is a great play, as you're ahead of any other made, but in this instance...

If he had the straight, two pair, a set, EVEN TOP PAIR TOP KICKER, (In which case the ace is no good) you're not ahead, you're on a bare flush draw.

Having said that, there is a tiny bit of dead money in the pot, but I dont like the push too much.

Calling isn't an option, because if you miss the draw, you're going to put the rest in on the turn, and if you make the flush, he may be able to get away from his hand.

Therefore, I would say it's fairly equal between raising or folding, and given this player is a gambler, (who could have king high flush draw!) raising isn't too bad.

That said, I would fold. Actually, I would've popped the original bettor back /images/graemlins/smile.gif But that's another stance!

ipp147

09-01-2004, 05:38 PM

[ QUOTE ]

That said, I would fold. Actually, I would've popped the original bettor back /images/graemlins/smile.gif But that's another stance!

[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah, as I said, I didn't know old crazy was actually crazy. So I figured it was sensible to keep as many people as possible until my flush hit. Now if I raised and everyone folded that wouldn't be bad. In hindsight he probably saw my flat call as weakness and thats when he got aggressive.

Oh to have my time over again /images/graemlins/smile.gif

me454555

09-01-2004, 05:39 PM

Why don't we start with the preflop play. limping w/AQs?!?! WHY?!?! you're just asking to be outdrawn.

Calling the flop bet? why? raise that. You have way too many outs to toss this and I think a push here is fine. You've got plenty of outs if you're behind ane even if he has you're Ace reverse dominated w/TPTK, you've got 12 outs and 2 draws at it.