$15-30 hand

Here's the hand mentioned in a post from a couple days ago where I got bluffed out. It's an odd hand against an odd player. I can defend my actions by quoting Pete Townshend, "I don't need to be forgiven!"


But hugged is okay.


$15-30. My first hand, I post behind the button (mistake!) and get K-7 suited. All fold to me and I raise. Button folds, small blind calls, big blind folds. Headsup.


Flop: A-2-3 rainbow. SB bets out.


I call.


Turn pairs the ace.


Small blind bets, I raise, he reraises, I almost rereraise but fold instead. He shows 8-5 offsuit.


I don't feel bad about this hand because:


1) I like this guy's voice and I gave him some chatter chips


2) Maybe now I'll go back to not posting behind


3) I'm pretty sure a four was coming on the river


Tommy


Tommy

That radar is really in high gear. Four-bet the turn /images/smile.gif

> 3) I'm pretty sure a four was coming on the river


Or a five, right?


When do you post if not behind the button?

you can't be serious about 4 betting the turn right?

A very bad fold I also think[Simi know}That a 4 Simply had to come .I see it all yhe time.

Up Front I hate money....

My question is why get involved when the flop really gave you nothing. I guess it would depend on the player, but I would have assumed he had some sort of hand to call your raise, especially since you have the reputation of being a very strong player. But when the flop comes even though it is likely he has also missed, couldnt he have very likely had a pocket pair and been betting into you to find out where he is at. Also wouldnt it have been reasonable to assume he might have been holding an ace, even though waiting to raise seems to be the play most people would make with an ace in that situation. I guess you had the right read origanally when you raised the turn, but I would think you would have to be really sure a guy was a total steal to put all that money in on the turn with K high.

Flop: A-2-3 rainbow. SB bets out.


I call.


How often do you call *with* an Ace here?

Tommy,


I'm just guessing here, but is there a chance that this hand is a result of your tendency to "fold to the 3-bet on the turn"?


I know you do the bullet fold frequently in these spots.


The reason I ask is actually unrelated to you. There is a post by a player in the small stakes forum. This player is very tight and while watching him online, I noticed that he had a tendancy to bet, raise frequently postflop but fold on the flop or turn when 3-bet. It was particularly noticable because he was in so few pots. I theorized at the time that it would be very easy to overplay against him since he chose the "raise and fold to a 3-bet" path rather than the "call twice" path.


I picked up on this in about 40 minutes. I'd imagine that people playing with you might have picked up on something similar with you. Then again, maybe not. Just thought I'd throw it out there and let you look in the mirror and see if it applies or not. Because, after all, you are the only one who can answer the question.


I'd give you an internet [[[HUGS]] since you asked, but it might look a little freaky. /images/smile.gif


Dave

If you were represented Aces, you should of raised the flop.

The question is would I have just called on the flop with an ace and the answer is lots of times yes, I'll just call on each street, to the river, unless be checks, and then I'll bet. I think this is a fine default.


The bad news is, I can't expect him to think that I would just call on the flop with an ace. After the hand he chirped some, saying, in short, that he read me good. And he did. Maybe for the wrong reason, doesn't matter. Bottom line is he made the play at the right time so I don't feel like I lost this hand as much as he won it.

"He shows 8-5 offsuit. "


Can't be all bad if he calls your steal/raises with trash hands like this.

Clarkmeister,


"your tendency to "fold to the 3-bet on the turn"."


Egads! I don't have a tendency to raise the turn heads up and fold for one more. But I do have a tendency to post hands that are troubling or amusing, and folding on the turn after raising is both. Twice I've walked to the bottom of the Grand Canyon, but I have no tendency to go there.


Tommy

Well, I can't find too much fault in your play here. After all, he had six pair outs and four gutshot outs to beat you, giving him a ten-out semi-bluff against you. Of course we'll just ignore whether his semi-bluff was reasonable or not, just as we'll ignore the actual result of the hand.


I'm curious what posessed either one of you to play it this way, but that's besides the point of your post. I'm not necessarily faulting your play, just curious. Was it the old 5th level thinking phenomenon? where you know that he knows that you know that he knows that you're both Magoos? Don't answer that! T'was a fun hand you posted, and we don't want to ruin it by over-analyzing it (something that NEVER happens on two-plus-two).


Dave in Cali