Violating Ed Miller's #1 rule

[me454555]

I folded on the river for 1 bet in a decent sized pot /images/graemlins/blush.gif I think this situation was the right play but I can't help thinking I might have screwed up

Party Poker 3/6 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with T/images/graemlins/club.gif, T/images/graemlins/spade.gif.
<font color="CC3333">UTG raises</font>, <font color="666666">2 folds</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="666666">5 folds</font>, UTG calls.

Flop: (7.33 SB) 5/images/graemlins/spade.gif, J/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 2/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">UTG bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG 3-bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero caps</font>, UTG calls.

Too aggressive withe the flop cap? UTG raised pf so I put him on either overcards or AJ. He could have a flush but more likely has either AJ w/out a spade or A or K /images/graemlins/spade.gif w/out the flush. I figure, he's either behind and drawing to 9 outs or I'm behind and drawing to 11 outs

Turn: (7.66 BB) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG calls.

River: (9.66 BB) A/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero folds.

I tossed it b/c well, I showed a whole lotta aggression in this hand and didn't think my TT was any good.

[Noodles]

yes it looks exactly like he has as you say AJ or A /images/graemlins/spade.gif and something else,i think the fold is ok here.
i dont think anyone would chance a bet with less than TT on the riv here hoping to make you think he has caught the ace or whatever.
doesnt slansky say "it doesnt matter sometimes if the pot offers 1000/1,sometimes you know you are beat ,throw it away" i think from the 1st hold em book

[dmk]

which rule, overplaying your hand?

[BusterStacks]

I think capping the flop here cannot be profitable in the longterm.

[chio]

on the river, ugh

terrible place to violate the rule, i say

[spamuell]

Can't his river bet be a bluff from a missed flush draw which didn't pair? Once you've capped the flop and he check-calls the turn and then bets out on the river, it's mighty suspicious. Yours heads-up, he's gonna try some tricky [censored]. I say call the river bet once you've bloated the pot.

[TheHip41]

That's a horrible fold.

laughing out loud

[balkii]

UTG raised pf so I put him on either overcards or AJ.

Ummmm....what about an overpair? What about an overpair with a spade? You gave too much action on the flop.

[Evan]

Why are you capping the flop?
There aren't many hands that he's rasing with UTG that you're beating. Here are some hands I like to raise form that position:
AA, KK, QQ, JJ, AK

You're only beating one of those (not that it couldn't be something else). Over cards could very possible have a better spade. I don't see any reason to cap the flop. You overplayed your hand, that's the reall problem, not the river fold.
FWIW I think you're definitely beat but need to call the river bet. It seems like a lot of people post hands like this, make reference to Ed's advice about not folding big pots on the river, and then try to explain how their hand is the exception. The reason for the advice is that there are very few exceptions. When in doubt, call the river bet.

[Noodles]

[ QUOTE ]
Can't his river bet be a bluff from a missed flush draw which didn't pair

[/ QUOTE ]
do you seriously think anyone would bluff here after the pfrs agression and think that in a pot that big they have any chance of getting away with it?
only a madman would try a bluff here and we dont get any sign that this guy is mad!

what it boils down to is that you only need to have the bettor beat 1 in 9 times here to make this play profitable. I certainly think that you'll see KQ, a lower pocket pair or who knows what other kind of trash (this IS party poker after all) more than 1 out of every 9 times you run into this situation. call.

[me454555]

Not profitable? I had a pair + a flushdraw. W/the J out its a 4th nut. If he's got an overpair w/out a spade, I'm in decent shape. If he's got overcards w/a spade I'm still in good shape. I capped b/c I thought there was a good chance I could have the best hand by the river if I didnt have the best hand right now. Only hands I really feared were AJ w/a spade or an overpair w/a spade.

[spamuell]

[ QUOTE ]

do you seriously think anyone would bluff here after the pfrs agression and think that in a pot that big they have any chance of getting away with it?

[/ QUOTE ]

Given that I said to call, I think it's pretty obvious that I do.

I said it in my last post and I'll say it again, people try some crazy [censored] HU.

EDIT: Just to add that I think it's pretty hilarious that when I have this thread open in a Mozilla Firefox tab with exactly the right amount of other threads open, the title reads Violating Ed Miller.

[Alexthegreat]

UTG I think he is more likely to limp reraise with AA,KK.....plus he just called hero's 3bet preflop..I think QQ caps here as well....I think the most likely holding is AK with a spade....I would totally 3 bet this flop with that hand...and slow down if I was capped....I think you have to call since you acted so strong on the flop....if people see you folding strongly played hands just because an ace falls on a later street, they may be inclined to take some shots at you.....