Bob T.
08-31-2004, 12:04 AM
Just some musings.
Earlier this evening, I played on a couple of 5-10 tables on UB. The pot sizes, and average players seeing the flop were in the ranges where I thought that I could make some money, 6-7 BBs, and low 30%.
On both tables, there were 8 players that had statistics that weren't different from those that you would expect to see from winning players, and 2 that were slightly, but not grossly out of line.
I played a little bit over an hour, and had a small win, which was actually almost on my longterm average for 5-10.
I wasn't able to ever isolate any of the weaker opponents.
I got isolated alot. It felt like every time I raised, someone came in for threebet behind me.
There wasn't any coldcalling behind me either.
I lost top pair, and also middle set to runner runner flushes.
How did I end up with a win?
I made one thin value raise on the river, when I made top pair on the river, my kicker was better than my opponents.
I flopped the nut flush when I played K8s in the SB, and got too much action from my opponent who had limped with AKo.
I got a free card and made the nut flush on the river against the BB who had flopped top pair, and paid off my river raise.
I got excess action when I flopped top set versus my opponents TPTK, going multiple bets on every street except the river.
On all of those hands, I thought that my opponents made mistakes postflop that cost them at least one Big Bet.
All of the players who made those mistakes were players that saw between 15% and 25% of the flops, and raised preflop between 6% and 12% of the time, with the limited sample sizes that you get on your opponents, you might believe that they are winning players, and they might be.
But even players that play well preflop frequently make a lot of mistakes postflop, and you might be able to win money from them.
I played almost a year and a half without using tracking software, and played by watching what kind of mistakes my opponents were making, and then tried to get them into those same situations again. I've started to use pokertracker lately, and I think that it is a great tool, especially for uncovering players with preflop weaknesses, but those players show up pretty easily if you are watching your game.
I suspect that as time goes on, and as we move up in limits, your opponents preflop play is going to get better and better, and the only way to separate yourself from them will be by how well you handle yourself postflop.
One of the reasons that NPA Ed Miller's book is going to be so valueable, is that he does a great job of describing the variables that you need to pay attention to postflop. I also think that even though it has been characterized as weak-tight, the Brier-Ciaffone book is going to become more and more important for players to read as the whole poker community becomes more sophisticated.
Good luck,
play well,
Bob T.
Earlier this evening, I played on a couple of 5-10 tables on UB. The pot sizes, and average players seeing the flop were in the ranges where I thought that I could make some money, 6-7 BBs, and low 30%.
On both tables, there were 8 players that had statistics that weren't different from those that you would expect to see from winning players, and 2 that were slightly, but not grossly out of line.
I played a little bit over an hour, and had a small win, which was actually almost on my longterm average for 5-10.
I wasn't able to ever isolate any of the weaker opponents.
I got isolated alot. It felt like every time I raised, someone came in for threebet behind me.
There wasn't any coldcalling behind me either.
I lost top pair, and also middle set to runner runner flushes.
How did I end up with a win?
I made one thin value raise on the river, when I made top pair on the river, my kicker was better than my opponents.
I flopped the nut flush when I played K8s in the SB, and got too much action from my opponent who had limped with AKo.
I got a free card and made the nut flush on the river against the BB who had flopped top pair, and paid off my river raise.
I got excess action when I flopped top set versus my opponents TPTK, going multiple bets on every street except the river.
On all of those hands, I thought that my opponents made mistakes postflop that cost them at least one Big Bet.
All of the players who made those mistakes were players that saw between 15% and 25% of the flops, and raised preflop between 6% and 12% of the time, with the limited sample sizes that you get on your opponents, you might believe that they are winning players, and they might be.
But even players that play well preflop frequently make a lot of mistakes postflop, and you might be able to win money from them.
I played almost a year and a half without using tracking software, and played by watching what kind of mistakes my opponents were making, and then tried to get them into those same situations again. I've started to use pokertracker lately, and I think that it is a great tool, especially for uncovering players with preflop weaknesses, but those players show up pretty easily if you are watching your game.
I suspect that as time goes on, and as we move up in limits, your opponents preflop play is going to get better and better, and the only way to separate yourself from them will be by how well you handle yourself postflop.
One of the reasons that NPA Ed Miller's book is going to be so valueable, is that he does a great job of describing the variables that you need to pay attention to postflop. I also think that even though it has been characterized as weak-tight, the Brier-Ciaffone book is going to become more and more important for players to read as the whole poker community becomes more sophisticated.
Good luck,
play well,
Bob T.