TT at party 2/4

[Eihli]

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (7 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is BB with T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
UTG folds, MP1 calls, <font color="CC3333">MP2 raises</font>, CO calls, Button calls, SB calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="CC3333">MP2 caps</font>, CO calls, Button calls, SB calls, Hero calls, MP1 calls.

Flop: (24 SB) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(6 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, MP1 checks, MP2 checks, CO checks, <font color="CC3333">Button bets</font>, SB folds, Hero calls, MP1 folds, MP2 calls, CO calls.

Turn: (14 BB) 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
Hero checks, MP2 checks, CO checks, <font color="CC3333">Button bets</font>, Hero folds, MP2 calls, CO folds.

River: (16 BB) A/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
MP2 checks, <font color="CC3333">Button bets</font>, MP2 calls.

Final Pot: 18 BB
<font color="green">Main Pot: 18 BB, between MP2 and Button.</font>

Thanks.

[InchoateHand]

Here is my very limited wisdom:
What reads? What would MP2 cap with? What would Button cold call with?
With no possible redraws to improved hands, you are drawing to two outs. The only reason to call the flop is if you are going to pop them on the turn--depending on the player, you might get TPNK to fold. I don't advocate this line, but other than that, my weak/tight self would ditch on the flop.
BTW---what would button cold call with? I have no idea, but not knowing his play, I'd guess Probably Axs, MAYBE AJo, and either way he's got to be a little concerned about his kicker....that is, until everyone faints in front of an ace. (Or he already has two pair).

[JohnShaft]

[ QUOTE ]
you are drawing to two outs. The only reason to call the flop is if you are going to pop them on the turn

[/ QUOTE ]
IH, that actually isn't true here.
We're getting at least 26-1 if we can see the Turn for one SB. As it's rainbow, and the T makes no straights, we have as pure a 2 outs as we can hope for. Therefore you SHOULD call the Flop bet here as opposed to folding.

The A on the flop very likely doesn't leave us drawing dead as:
1. The person that raise/capped checked the flop. This is a very likely underpair, like KK, that does not want to fold in this huge pot. We can extract some more out of him if we play it correctly (and hit our set).
2. Also it looks like the Button Coldcalled with an Ace, which makes MP2 having the case Aces close to impossible. I only mention this fact because SOME (bad players) will slowplay a set of A's like this.

So what I'm saying is we are drawing to 2 VERY GOOD Ten outs. So our odds are definitely good enough to put a single bet in to take a card off.

I do think we're behind to Buttons AA, and even if we're not MP2 has a better underpair that he likely won't fold (at least not until he gets pressure we can't bring).

The fold on the Turn is good. One of our outs just got muddied, and we aren't getting Odds anyway.

We could bet the flop but then we're often paying 2 bets to take a card off when we could pay one. As we're VERY likely behind here I think that is a bad move.


[ QUOTE ]
depending on the player, you might get TPNK to fold.

[/ QUOTE ]
No way in hell someone folds AK here. It just ain't happening.
[Later edit: TP*NO*K, John, you idiot. I gotta watch out for this one.]

[InchoateHand]

Thank you for the clarification on the flop-call, but please notice I wrote top pair NO kicker.
Regards.

[JohnShaft]

[ QUOTE ]
Thank you for the clarification on the flop-call, but please notice I wrote top pair NO kicker.
Regards.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ah sorry, so you did. I'm so used to seeing TPTK that I misread it for that. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I do think your chance of getting the Button to fold a bad Ace is slim to none. Rule of thumb is anyone who sees the flop for 4 bets with a bad Ace is not folding on a raggy Ace high flop.