"Please don't call" bets [Archive] - Two Plus Two Older Archives

ddubois

08-24-2004, 07:34 PM

I've been experimenting with overbetting monster pairs to make it look like I don't want callers. In the first level or two, this seems to have the effect of inducing calls from fish who assume you have AK or a medium pair, and that you are fearful of post-flop play, but I don't have a large enough sample size to say for sure. A side benefit is that I crush implied odds. (BTW, I only intend to do this type of bet with this type of holding at most once per tournament; I don't want this bet size to be a tell.) I think this strategy has merits and flaws - how good/bad is it overall?

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|saw showdown

Hero (t685)
Button (t935)
SB (t55)
BB (t945)
UTG (t2325)
UTG+1 (t485)
MP1 (t715)
MP2 (t1855)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K/images/graemlins/heart.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
1 fold, UTG+1 calls t30, MP1 calls t30, MP2 calls t30, Hero raises to t200, 1 fold, SB calls t40 (All-In), 1 fold, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 calls t170.

Flop: (t545) 3/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players, 1 all-in)
MP2 checks, Hero bets t485 (All-In), MP2 calls t485.

Turn: (t1515) 8/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players, 2 all-in)

River: (t1515) 9/images/graemlins/spade.gif (3 players, 2 all-in)

Final Pot: t1515
Main Pot: t255 (t255), between Hero, SB and MP2. > Pot won by Hero (t255).
Pot 2: t1260 (t1260), between Hero and MP2. > Pot won by Hero (t1260).

Results in white below: 
SB shows Ah 9h (two pair, nines and threes).
MP2 shows 5c 5s (two pair, fives and threes).
Hero shows Kh Kd (two pair, kings and threes).
Outcome: Hero wins t1515. 

----------------------------------

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (10 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

saw flop|saw showdown

SB (t755)
Hero (t1440)
UTG (t580)
UTG+1 (t495)
UTG+2 (t1420)
MP1 (t165)
MP2 (t960)
MP3 (t700)
CO (t350)
Button (t1135)

Preflop: Hero is BB with A/images/graemlins/club.gif, A/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG calls t30, 1 fold, UTG+2 calls t30, 5 folds, SB completes, Hero raises to t200, UTG calls t170, UTG+2 folds, SB folds.

Flop: (t460) 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 2/images/graemlins/diamond.gif (2 players)
Hero bets t380, UTG calls t380 (All-In).

Turn: (t1220) 2/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

River: (t1220) 8/images/graemlins/club.gif (2 players, 1 all-in)

Final Pot: t1220
Main Pot: t1220 (t1220), between Hero and UTG. > Pot won by Hero (t1220).

Results in white below: 
Hero shows Ac Ad (two pair, aces and twos).
UTG shows 6c Ks (one pair, twos).
Outcome: Hero wins t1220.

durron597

08-24-2004, 07:58 PM

If the game is running loose it's a good strategy, but good people won't call such a big bet with a hand like AJ (I know I wouldn't) - you definitely will get less of an audience if people know what their doing (just because they don't want to risk so much of their stack preflop on a hand like 99/TT/AJ/AQ etc.)

Cry Me A River

08-26-2004, 01:33 AM

I've also found this works really, really well early in large freerolls (OT, but whatever). Including post-flop where pushing with a flopped set or 2-pair on an uncordinated board will get you called by top-pair, second pair and any old thing about 90% of the time.

You can only do this as long as there are still loose/crappy players in the game and they quickly eliminate each other so beware of pulling this move too late or you wind up wasting a good hand just stealing the blinds or only getting called by hands you don't really want calling you.

The real key is being able to translate the early chip lead into a strong finish. Otherwise the very real chance of getting knocked out early makes for a dodgy proposition.

ilya

08-26-2004, 01:05 PM

I don't understand at what point you're overbetting in these hands. The raise to 200 with KK seems completely standard ((3xbb + (1xbb * 3limpers)) = 180), and on the flop you don't even have enough chips to bet the pot. But I presume you're not talking about the flop.
In the AA hand, your raise again seems pretty standard. Maybe a little larger than the 'by-the-book' amount, but only by 20-40 chips.
So whaddaya mean?

Cheers,
ilya

Vannek

08-31-2004, 09:24 PM

I played with a guy who did bet like this, and your right I picked that as a tell and when he min betted the flop a raggedy flop I raised pot on him, he folded in less than a second.