Big set - I hate my play. Flame away

I'm in 2 off the button with KhKc and open raise. Button, SB, and BB call.


Flop: Ks Ah 8h


I like it. Should get me lots of action. If someone makes a flush on the turn I will have tons of outs to beat them.


Blinds check. I bet. Button raises and blinds fold. I know the button would raise here with an A or with a flush draw. He's usually aggressive enough to follow up a flop raise with a turn bet. I decide to call and check raise the turn. I hate myself for it, but I did it.


Turn: [Ks Ah 8h] 3h


I check and to my horror so does the button. Now I really hate myself. I was going to check raise. I figured I will have the best hand most of the time. When he has a flush, I will have 8 heart outs plus 10 FH/Quad outs.


River: [Ks Ah 8h 3h] 7h


I bet and get called. Amazingly enough, My nuts are good. He didn't show his hand.


I absolutely hate my play on the flop and turn. I think this is a major leak in my game. When I flop a big hand and get raised, I call and look for 2 bets on the turn way too often. I think this sometimes works well when I have position, but not when I'm out of position.


I don't have any idea what he would have played this way. I don't know what hand he could have checked the turn with and still called the river. When he checked the turn it looked like the 3rd heart scared him, but he still called when I bet the 4th. Regardless, the fact that he called the river with such a scary board tells me that I missed a couple of bets.


Comments? Feel free to give me your worst. At least I won't get a Dynasty, "Congrats, you managed to play it wrong on every street." I think I played it well before the flop. /images/smile.gif

At least I won't get a Dynasty, "Congrats, you managed to play it wrong on every street." I think I played it well before the flop. /images/smile.gif


Yeah. But, I can adjust my "play" here on the forum too.


When I flop a big hand like a set and I'm out of position, I usually just 3-bet the flop and don't bother trying for a turn checkraise.


If you 3-bet the flop and bet the turn, you will collect 1.5 big bets. If you smooth-call the flop and successfully check-raise the turn, you will collect 2.0 big bets.


Therefore, in order for the checkraise to be the better play, it needs to succeed 75% of the time.

Don't forget the times you may get raised on the turn, and may get to 3 bet. When you smooth call and go for the checkraise, you represent a much stronger hand than the 3 bet bet out. Therefore, you have a much better chance of getting raised on the turn than 3 bet after you check raise.


If you 3 bet the flop and then get to 3 bet the turn, you collect 3.5 extra bets, almost twice as much as the check raise play.

You probably should have checkraised him on the river. When he checks on the turn u know he's either got a weak-ace or a flush draw. If u check the turn and river he is sure to bet the ace, and might try to bluff with a busted flush draw.


I don't agree with the above post though. Given the action - U raised from the cutoff and the button just flat called. It is very unlikely that he has a hand that can raise u on the turn if you 3 bet the flop and bet the turn. Usually the guy will have Axs in this spot. The check raise wasn't a bad idea if you think he would bet Ax on the turn and pay off the turn and river. Good players would probably muck it on the turn though. You can also try flat calling the raise on the flop and then bet the turn. If your opponent is aggressive then he will raise u again, thinking that u would have 3 bet him on the flop with a big hand. Flat calling on the flop and betting the turn looks like you have a weak ace trying to prevent a free card. U should generally 3 bet the flop and bet all the way though. U didn't play it that badly though, it just turned out that way.

Dav, that's a good point that I hadn't thought much about. In this case if I three bet the flop and lead the turn, I don't think there's any way I would have gotten raised. In general though, there is a much better chance of getting 3 bets on the turn in than if I smooth call the flop and go for the check raise. I don't think many people would 3 bet a turn check raise after I showed that much strength without the nuts.

"If you 3-bet the flop and bet the turn, you will collect 1.5 big bets. If you smooth-call the flop and successfully check-raise the turn, you will collect 2.0 big bets.


Therefore, in order for the checkraise to be the better play, it needs to succeed 75% of the time."


This isn't exactly true, as sometimes by calling and checking the turn you'll persuade your opponent to bet a hand that he would have folded for a bet on the turn if you'd three-bet the flop.


This decision is close. With two high cards out there, and the ace being a heart, I would usuallly assume he has an ace as opposed to a draw, which means your decision is based largely on whether you think it's possible to scare your opponent off his hand. If the answer is 'no', then I'd check-raise the turn. If the answer is 'yes', then I'd probably three bet the flop and lead bet the turn and the river.

three bet the flop, bet the turn check and call on the river when fourth heart arrives.