Just how strong is TPTK?

[SlantNGo]

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t30 (10 handed)

CO (t285)
Button (t930)
SB (t1135)
BB (t765)
Hero (t985)
UTG+1 (t2215)
UTG+2 (t605)
MP1 (t300)
MP2 (t750)
MP3 (t30)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with A/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/heart.gif.
<font color="CC3333">Hero raises to t120</font>, UTG+1 folds, UTG+2 folds, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, MP3 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB folds, BB calls t90.

Flop: (t255) A/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 9/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(2 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">BB bets t150</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises to t865 (All-In)</font>, BB calls t495 (All-In).

Turn: (t1765) 5/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(2 players, 2 all-in)</font>

River: (t1765) J/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(2 players, 2 all-in)</font>

Final Pot: t1765

Did I overbet my TPTK here? I went over the top because I saw the coordinated board and wanted to take the hand right there. No read on BB.

[parappa]

I think this is routine. If he showed you a heart flush, straight, set or two pair, I wouldn't be surprised, but I'd play it the same way.

[NotMitch]

Without a read it would be hard to fold this here and if you are not going to fold raising all in on the flop is much better than calling.

[Sam T.]

Note to Erostratus: Skip this post. I've never finshed higher than tenth in a SnG.

Based on my experience, TPTK early in the game runs from great to awful. In the situation you described, it is equally likely you lost to 97s (or Mr AnyAce, playing A9o) as you beat AQ. I tend to play TPTK pretty strongly, and either double-up or go down in flames.

In the middle stages, TPTK will win you small to medium pots, or bust you out of the game. The morons who will double you up are already gone, but so is Mr AnyAce. At tht point your biggest worry is a set, someone willing to call big bets with a draw, or a strong two pair if the board is something along the lines of QKx. I tend to bet TPTK pretty hard on the flop (usually pot-sized), and if someone calls/raises alarm bells start going off, and I look for ways to get out of the hand.

On the bubble and after, TPTK is gold, and I'm willing to put my stack behind it.

But what do I know? I'm weak tight.

Regarding this hand, I think you played it fine. If you ran into a set, so be it, but you can't let someone hang around with a flush draw.

[tallstack]

IMO, TPTK works better here than in some other recent posted situations because you raised preflop and got it HU before the flop. A7, A9, and 97 are not as likely here. You may be against a set, but aces you can beat, underpairs and flush draws are all possibilities. I would likely push here as well.

Dave S

[jedi]

[ QUOTE ]
Note to Erostratus: Skip this post. I've never finshed higher than tenth in a SnG.



[/ QUOTE ]

LOL. At one point I considered putting Erostratus on "ignore" but his posts are just golden, even for a troll. That having been said, your results will improve immediately if you switch to Poker Stars SnGs because they are 9 handed /images/graemlins/smile.gif

Anyways, if it's in the middle of a SnG, I'd tread more carefully with TPTK. If it's early, like it is here, I'd be willing to just push and pray. You're either doubled up, or you're out with not much time invested in it.

Of course, this depends on what level you're playing at. In a $50 or $100 SnG, you're likely not going to get called when you're ahead. In a $10 SnG, you will.

[SlantNGo]

This was level 2 in a 5+1 at Party. So you guys are all in favor of pushing even though that's a raise of twice the size of the pot? I pushed instinctively because I thought I had the best hand here, to protect my hand, then afterwards, I thought, since the pot is only at around 400, what if I only raised it up to 400 or so? If he folds, great, if he re-raises, the consequence will be no different than if I went all-in except I now have a chance to get out. If he only calls, then I think I'm ahead.

[ddubois]

[ QUOTE ]
Flop: (t255) A, 7, 9 (2 players)
BB bets t150, Hero raises to t865 (All-In), BB calls t495 (All-In)....what if I only raised it up to 400 or so? If he folds, great, if he re-raises, the consequence will be no different than if I went all-in except I now have a chance to get out.

[/ QUOTE ]
I don't think you can raise to 400, and then fold when he pushes - that's only another 245 to you with 1055 in the pot. You have signifigant outs aganst two pair, he might be semi-bluffing, and this being party, he might think his AQ/AJ/AT/A8/A6/A5 is good.

[Sam T.]

First of all, quit playing the $5+1. If bankroll is an issue, switch to Stars ($5+50). If not, jump up to the $10+1.

[ QUOTE ]
I pushed instinctively because I thought I had the best hand here, to protect my hand, then afterwards, I thought, since the pot is only at around 400, what if I only raised it up to 400 or so? If he folds, great, if he re-raises, the consequence will be no different than if I went all-in except I now have a chance to get out. If he only calls, then I think I'm ahead.

[/ QUOTE ]

Interesting idea. But barring another A or K, your hand is as good as it's going to get, and with the flush draw on the board the same may not be true of him. You want him to fold here, and the best way to to do that is push.

More importantly, a raise to t400 would be almost half your stack, and the rule of thumb is that if you're going to bet over 30% you are better off with a push.

[SlantNGo]

Thanks for your input guys. He flipped over 99 and took me down to like 200 or so. Next hand, I got KK and went all in and got 2 callers both with QJ and went back up to 600 something.

[patrick dicaprio]

when you way overbet the pot like this you will only be called if beaten usually. plus you were the raiser and now when an A flops you are bet into. usually this is not a good sign. if you thought you were against a draw a better play here is to just call and if the turn does not make the draw then if it is checked to you make a big bet. but TPTK is usually not strong when you are the raiser a strong board is out there and you are bet into.

Pat

[AleoMagus]

There are only a few cases in which I would not be too confident of TPTK

a) All suited board. If I have one of the suit, especially the ace, I'm still not scared.

b) A board with three co-ordinated ranks of medium to high value. ie- 89T, JTQ, etc...

c) Small flops, TPTK will still get a lot of calls from overpairs and if there was a preflop raiser you might be in big trouble. flopping 427 when you have A7 can be dangerous

d) All broadway card flops. lots of potential straights but I'm still usually never folding here because I will also have a few extra outs with my straight draw as well

e) Paired flops. If you only hold TPTK and the flop has an underpair present, big raises often mean you are up against trips.

These scenarios are only scenarios that scare me, but not scenarios in which I'd ALWAYS fold to big bets or re-raises.

Your scenario is none of these and I'd have played it about the same. I think a smaller raise on the flop is bad. Yes, if you are called you are probably beat, but you need to charge the draws with a pot sized bet and you are committed anyways if you do.

Regards
Brad S