Discipline doesnt pay?

[youngin20]

I know that people here always say "Its all one long session" etc, but just coming back from a session where I think I showed pretty good discipline(folding ace-rag, k-9s etc in the proper positions) and playing my draws(I had 5 hands where I was drawing to an Ace high straight and three nut flush draws that never got there...I DIDNT DRAG A SINGLE POT. sigh. I guess this is a bad way to introduce myself to the community, I have been playing by Winning Low Limit Poker by Lee Jones almost to a T, so....any ideas?

[bisonbison]

It happens. I mean, honestly, do you expect every session to be a winning session? Because the reality is just not that way.

[sfer]

I find flopping the nuts is the best strategy.

[Bob T.]

Welcome to the forum.

Keep doing those things. Eventually it will work out. The short run is longer than you imagine right now.

Good luck,
play well,

Bob T.

[Bob T.]

Because the reality is just not that way.

Over the last three years, I have won on 70% of the days that I played, which means that something else happened on 30% of the days. I wish that I could get that number a lot higher, but as you said, the reality is that it just isn't that way.

Good luck,
play well,

Bob T.

[youngin20]

Thanks, I dont expect every session to be a winning one, but I just....gah, its tough to get back in it when I feel I make every call right, and drop my hand when I know I was outdrawn, etc. BTW, anyone know what to do with A-9o in MP?

[rayrns]

Fold.

[Garland]

[ QUOTE ]
any ideas?

[/ QUOTE ]

Keep playing.
Accept the fact that you can go long sessions without winning.
Never ever tell bad beat stories.

With all that: Welcome aboard /images/graemlins/cool.gif.

Garland

[goofball]

without a doubt fold.

unless the flop will bring aces up or better.

[youngin20]

Just checking. I was almost positive, and some guy flips A-9o, drags a monster, I mention that I had folded the same hand that round, and some guy goes off on me, saying he would kill to see an ace. dont they get that full handed they are probably beaten? sigh.

[MAxx]

nope they dont get it, and that's exactly the kind of person you want sitting at your table

[MicroBob]

i would recommend keep playing.
but i also would recommend to really start studying beyond just lee jones (SSHE by Miller, these forums).

even very good players will have losing days....or even losing weeks. and you are not a very good player (yet)...nor am i. so we will have slightly more frequent losing days.

some days you will hit your draws, other days you won't.

the best thing to do is to post the hand-histories here (preferrably the condensed version) and seek input regarding whether you played them correctly or not. there are probably many situations where you bet where you should have checked and vice-versa.

you would also be wise to read through some of the other HH's here and some of the comments.

you also need to recognize that the reason why lee jones' weak-tight strategy can be successful is precisely because others play much much too loose.
don't tell others that you do or do not play A9.
don't tell others anything about what hands you play.

that is all.

[MarkL444]

This loss seems to have taken a lot out of you metally. It sounds as though you are playing in a game too large for your bankroll. You might want to check into that.

[youngin20]

I was playing 4/8, TBH I would rather play 1/2 or 2/4 or even 3/6, I usually play with about 100 in 4/8, I am pretty sure that is not enough, but usually I double up or so in a 2-5 hour session

[MarkL444]

Not how much you buy in for...

Tto play in the 4/8 you should have about 2 grand set aside for poker.

[MicroBob]

you should be playing 1/2 or lower.

[fluff]

You show some critical lack of Bankroll understanding, which is not surprising since WLLH (and almost all other poker books) do not mention this.

First thing you need to do is figure out what limit of poker you have enough of a bankroll for. A sufficient bankroll is generally 300 Big Bets, so if you have $1200 set aside, you have 300 big bets for 2/4 limit, and that's where you should play.

Also a $100 buy in for a 4/8 game is generally not enough, although for an Internet game its not so bad as you can replenish chips quickly. Still, I would try to buy in for 25 BBs.

My feeling is that you're playing scared money, which is why this "bad beats" are affecting you so much.

[jimswarthow]

Youngin,
Im in the same position. I took a 4 month break to really work on building my business and now my first 2 sessions back I am down 2.5 racks.$250 This is over 17 hours of play. I am a very tight player. The last 4 months I re-read every poker book I own and some. I also spent countless at Poker school online coountng outs, figuring odds and generally honing my game. I am also committed to tracking my play. So I feel your pain. BE GRATEFUL when people drag down pots from early and MP with Axo. Thats how we at least presume to make money. talking to myself as well as you. And shut up at the table. You are not there to teach school or hold court. Have fun be friendly if you like but just say nice hand sir. That phrase pretty much sums up whatever it is you really want to say. You are there to win money you need every advantage you can get trust me
"Sugar Mr. Poon?"
"No never never"

[Mons]

[ QUOTE ]
You show some critical lack of Bankroll understanding, which is not surprising since WLLH (and almost all other poker books) do not mention this.


[/ QUOTE ]

WLLH pg. 160

[umdpoker]

"The short run is longer than you imagine right now. "

holy crap, is it ever longer than i imagined when i first started playing. i still remember averaging like 5bb/hr/table for the first 5k hands or so, and thinking i was a superstar. i was quite shocked to find out that its just as easy to lose over 5k hands, even if you are a superstar( which i am most definitely not).

[Atropos]

Yes you should never forget that poker is not a game like chess. The variance is very very high, and even davidross broke even over 28k hands one time.

[tolbiny]

I'm sure that everyone is saying the same thing, so i willl cut my reading of the thread short- however i was at a great table last night, four really weak really losies, one loose aggressive, two 2+2er's and threee other players who were loose, predictable and weak. I lost over a grand. This stuff happens, becomeing a good card player is about playing the right way for a long time.... a LONG time.

"What kind of name is POON anyway?"

[Blarg]

[ QUOTE ]
Thanks, I dont expect every session to be a winning one, but I just....gah, its tough to get back in it when I feel I make every call right, and drop my hand when I know I was outdrawn, etc

[/ QUOTE ]

You know, that should be exactly what makes you WANT to come back and more confident than ever.

I know that sounds like baloney, but seriously.

What makes me not want to come back to the table is knowing that I played badly when I lost. Playing well even though you were losing, even through the losses and the pressure and negativity that can bring up, is without a doubt a mark of a good player and an absolutely key ability if you want to be a winning player.

If you can look back on a session where you got the living crap kicked out of you over and over, got dragged through the mud and everyone was laughing at you and pelting you with tomatoes and dead animals, and you STILL managed to play well, you're a solid player with a lot to feel good about, in a lot of ways that extend even past the poker table.

Luck, you can't do anything about, so it's pointless and self-destructive to blame yourself about. Plus, it's egotistical. If there's a God, he probably doesn't spend a lot of effort arranging what happens at poker tables specifically to screw YOU up. Nor does probability work that way. You're not important enough in the universe for things to work that way for either God or the numbers.

So take your lumps like everyone else; there's no special limo waiting to chauffer you easily through poker. If you play well and win, great. If you play well and lose, oh well, welcome to the club. If you play well and lose and the money goes to the biggest idiots you've ever seen, who gave you bad beat after bad beat -- fantastic! What luck that your nasty dark cloud has a silver lining! At least you know you'll see that money again sometime. Good luck getting it back if a good player had gotten his mitts on it.

Oh, another helpful thing to keep in mind -- draws are supposed to lose. The more draws you try, the more you're supposed to lose. Sometimes, you will get a nice surprise though, and sometimes that nice surprise hits for good money; good enough to make up for all you lost and maybe more. It's a chancy thing, though. You really can't let yourself feel bad about draws not panning out in the short run. In the short run, they generally don't.

[brassnuts]

The short run is longer than you imagine right now.

Ain't that the truth. When I first started playing, I had winning sessions 20 out of my first 22 times. I started to think that it was always going to be like that. Then I had some small losing sessions and some small winning sessions. Then I hit 5 sessions in a row where I dropped 20 big bets each. Each night was exactly how you just described your session. Actually, that's not quite true. The losing was affecting my mental game and I was making mistakes. But, I decided to take a couple weeks off. Since then I've had some small losses and small wins mixed in with a few monsterous nights up over 50 big bets. Just hang in there, youngin. Poker is a game of ups and downs.

[jayrutz2]

Read Zen and the Art of Poker

Sounds like a night when the energy isn't flowing your way, nothing to do but play right and smile...

[BaronVonCP]

Start playing Ace rag, and K9.

[RoyalSampler]

hahahaha, that's nasty /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[youngin20]

maybe, i dont really like to connected hands where the straight is not the nuts... then again, at the session i had before this one, I saw a guy JUST CALL on 5th st. with the NUT STRAIGHT FLUSH. WHAT?????

[busguy]

Have you played with Baron ??

He is being serious.

/images/graemlins/wink.gif busguy

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]

Fold.

[/ QUOTE ]

bah, he definately needs to bet the river.

[Eihli]

i didn't read any of these other posts but I'm sure they all say something about how you aren't anywhere near long run.

[Lawrence Ng]

Welcome Rookie,

I always thought the first year was the hardest in poker.

Keep playing and practicing. It's the only way to improve.

Poker is like any other business. Most businesses take a while to pick up and a lot fail or lose money the first year. But with hard work, good practice, some smarts you can turn it into a nice profit down the road.