Loose play on Pacific Poker

[flopmonster]

I have been playing online for just about a month, using UltimateBet and have been doing decent. My friend got a Pacific Poker acct and read me off some of the numbers, plyrs/flop etc. I just started an acct there and the games are twice as loose as UB. Is there any reason for this?

[AncientPC]

UB is considered (again hearsay from other posters on 2+2) to have some of the tightest players around as they get most of their business through cardplayers.com.

Pacific is supposedly on terms with Party Poker, so I guess they advertise a lot through other venues that attrict more Joe Schmoes.

I was a Joe Schmoe attracted to Party Poker through some random web site as well, luckily a friend told me about 2+2 and I've been reading up. /images/graemlins/grin.gif

[cnfuzzd]

pacific poker is tied to casino-on-net, or something, and they get a lot of house game players through their portal. Makes for some interesting games. I would say by far some of the loosest around. The great thing is, the software is so crappy, there is no mutitabling, and clearing bonuses is so difficult, that few of the expert players are there. Occasionally you will run into a shark, but usually its just some moron like myself with a stuck raise button.

peace

john nickle

[papawawa]

While its true that Pacific is very loose (average players/flop is 75%), nailing down bad players is difficult I've found. Pacific fish have a pack mentality. When you raise preflop hoping to knock out players, it somehow encourages all the fish to either call or fold, leaving you with either not much more than the blinds or sucked out. I generally look for the loosest games, however; even then, times will come when EVERYBODY folds preflop without a raise. Plus tables at the low limits will degenerate very quickly. Has anyone else noticed this?

[helpmeout]

Its hard to get good reads on people at pacific. The pack mentality is definately true, if a couple of people call then everyone feels its safe, if a couple fold they all fold.

The best games have a couple of maniacs that like to prove that they are the most aggressive. Its very annoying when they finally do hit a hand and you have top pair and think they are bluffing.

I really need to seek out and follow some maniacs but it is too much effort to research at 5c/10c level.

[skierdude1000]

Pacific is where the fish are at my friend

[dfscott]

I agree with one of the other posters that said that the reason the players are so bad there is that all the things that good players like aren't available. But it really is ridiculously easy -- I've been playing 1/2 just to clear a bonus and almost tripled my money in 2 weeks (YMMV). Yes, you'll get sucked out by people calling down the river, but those people will make you money in the long run. Just be patient -- my biggest pots have come from Pacific.

If only the PP 1/2 tables were this good... /images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Wahoo91]

I play both Pacific and UB (actually have not played Pacific in about a month) but the difference is night and day. UB is by far the tightest site I have played out of Pacific, Party, Stars, Golden Palace.

Pacific is BY FAR the loosest, and quite amazing the size pots you can pick up. Even if you just wait for the nuts there you can clear some serious $$ becuase the whole table will call you down.

[cardcounter0]

The games do break up strangely. If you have been playing with the same players for a couple of orbits, and one player leaves, it is a 50% chance that you will be sitting at an empty table within the next 4-5 hands.

[Wahoo91]

Card-
That is very true and different between the sites.

Pacific tables break up if someone breathes heavy, and I find that I have to change tables several times per hour sometimes. At UB I very rarely ever have to change tables over my normal 2-3 hour sessions becasue of table break.

[Marquis]

I've also noticed the pack mentality. Raising UTG and getting 8 callers frustrated me enough to take a break from Pacific. I needed to save my laptop and the window I've wanted to hurl it through while playing there. I'll be back, though.

[dfscott]

[ QUOTE ]
I've also noticed the pack mentality. Raising UTG and getting 8 callers frustrated me enough to take a break from Pacific.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why is that bad? I raised with QQ from UTG+2 first in last night and was happy to see that I got 2 cold callers (3 if you count the BB). Dead money in the pot is a good thing.

Try that same move on PP 1/2 and you'll be often be sadly scooping the blinds.

[Marquis]

[ QUOTE ]
Why is that bad? I raised with QQ from UTG+2 first in last night and was happy to see that I got 2 cold callers (3 if you count the BB). Dead money in the pot is a good thing.


[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think QQ holds up well against 8 calling stations.

[dfscott]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Why is that bad? I raised with QQ from UTG+2 first in last night and was happy to see that I got 2 cold callers (3 if you count the BB). Dead money in the pot is a good thing.


[/ QUOTE ]


I don't think QQ holds up well against 8 calling stations.

[/ QUOTE ]

Au contraire. Here's QQ against 8 psuedo-random opponents:

cards win %win lose %lose tie %tie EV
4h 3h 39011 14.02 239090 85.92 155 0.06 0.140
Qs Qh 62091 22.31 216010 77.63 155 0.06 0.223
5s 5d 15818 5.68 257381 92.50 5057 1.82 0.066
Kd 9d 33062 11.88 242780 87.25 2414 0.87 0.123
8s 7s 38215 13.73 236881 85.13 3160 1.14 0.143
5c Jh 421 0.15 269524 96.86 8311 2.99 0.016
Ac 9h 38269 13.75 237573 85.38 2414 0.87 0.142
Ts Jd 25483 9.16 249364 89.62 3409 1.23 0.097
7d 2d 12311 4.42 262785 94.44 3160 1.14 0.050

You're winning this over 22% of the time. For every BB you put in, you're getting about a 98% return on your money. Not a bad investment at all.

[Marquis]

[ QUOTE ]
You're winning this over 22% of the time. For every BB you put in, you're getting about a 98% return on your money. Not a bad investment at all.


[/ QUOTE ]

I knew that was coming. But do you WANT 8 callers to that raise? It certainly adds to the variance and I'm not convinced it's more profitable to play that hand consistently vs. 8 people than vs. 3. I wouldn't mind being proven wrong; I'll hop back on Pacific tonight.

[dfscott]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
You're winning this over 22% of the time. For every BB you put in, you're getting about a 98% return on your money. Not a bad investment at all.


[/ QUOTE ]

I knew that was coming. But do you WANT 8 callers to that raise? It certainly adds to the variance and I'm not convinced it's more profitable to play that hand consistently vs. 8 people than vs. 3. I wouldn't mind being proven wrong; I'll hop back on Pacific tonight.

[/ QUOTE ]

I understand how you feel. If you play QQ and lose with it 7 times out of 10, it sucks. However, if you can get the callers every time, you will make money with it in the long run.

That said, I generally don't try to push small edges at Pacific. If an A flops on my QQ, I'll be much more likely to throw it away to resistance than I would at PP 1/2. On the other hand, I'll be much more likely to limp or even cold-call 2 with a junky suited hand like A8s at Pacific, because I know I'll get paid off if I hit my flush.

[Wahoo91]

dfscott is right-
8 callers when you have the best hand will be VERY profitable in the long run. At Pacific you do have to play differently than other sites because someone will hit that Ace overcard almost every time, and will never fold.

Changing gears to play at Pacific after someplace like UB is tough, but after the initial transition, Pacific is MUCH more profitable. As mentioned in other posts, however, becuase there are so many people in every pot, the hands there take MUCH longer (and you cannot multi-table there). Prepare to be bored....

[flopmonster]

I got sick of the 2/4 game, although I know I'll slay it in the long run... Too many bad beats for one night. However the 5/10 game that I tried for an hour is just about comparable to the UB 1/2 game, possibly looser.

[cnfuzzd]

yeah, 5-8 players to every flop combined with horrible slow animation make for very few hands. And then the lobby lies to you and says 60 hds hr,, HA!

peace

john nickle

[lefty rosen]

I played at Pacific for about 6 months when the site was very small. Everything you guys are talking about happens at higher levels then even micro limits. The 2/4 full games can be similar to a very loose Party .5/1 game with 4 times the profits(maybe 4.25 since there is less rake). I prefer playing tigher games but I have been guy raising 10/10 or JJ under the gun and getting 8 cold caller and seeing a brick board and knowing I was done post flop. Also I have been the guy on the button or one before the button calling Q3 suited and getting overwhelming pot odds for a flush draw and hitting it and dragging down 80 buck pots.......