Appropriate definition of a "string bet"

[3rdEye]

My understanding is that a string bet involves betting in more than one motion *outside* one's staging area. The other day in my home game, a guy accused me of string raising. What I did was I called the BB and then stacked out chips for a 3x BB raise, put the chips together, and only then did I move the chips forward into the betting area. He argued that this constituted a string bet, which, as I explained, is ridiculous, since I was within my reasonable chip staging area.

Well, I'm almost positive I was right, but I'd just like some confirmation from you all, in the hopes that I can settle this argument.

By the way, it was obvious why my buddy was so adamant about my "string betting." He wanted to see the flop cheaply, and my raise prevented that. After I raised (the consensus at the table was that I hadn't done anything wrong), he raised me all-in (thinking that I'd either fold, or he'd have a chance to suck out on me and piss me off). I knew he was "tilting," as it were, as a result of our argument, so, having QQ, I called. He actually had 4c 6c!

The flop comes Qs Ts 3c, so needless to say, he hit his 5% miracle runner-runner clubs, and I'm out of the game.

[maryfield48]

[ QUOTE ]
What I did was I called the BB and then stacked out chips for a 3x BB raise, put the chips together, and only then did I move the chips forward into the betting area.

[/ QUOTE ]

What do you mean by "called the BB"? If you put the chips in the pot for the call, and then went back to your stack for the raise that sounds like a string bet. If you said "Call" and then put together the chips for the raise, that sounds like a string bet.

[gmunny]

Roberts rules state:
"String raises are not allowed. To protect your right to raise, you should either declare your intention verbally or place the proper amount of chips into the pot. Putting a full bet plus a half-bet or more into the pot is considered to be the same as announcing a raise, and the raise must be completed."

When you say you "called the big blind", I am assuming that you counted out the BB and kept the chips directly in front of you. If that were the case, then I don't think it is a string bet. If you moved the BB amount anywhere towards the center of the table, you may be crossing the line and should have either said "raise" before you did this. Just curious what did everyone else say at the table?
G$

[italianstang]

At my home game we have a stated rule, printed up and tacked on the wall along with 10 other rules, that the host's decision is final. While some people may argue about it, all the players understand. Then decisions like this don't become tricky because the host decides and you move on. From your post it sounds like it was not a string bet.

[dancraw]

Yep....that's a string bet. You called the BB, that's the end of your action. If you wanted to raise, you should have either put all your chips in at once, the rest of the blind and your raise, or verbally announced that you intended to raise.

[3rdEye]

[ QUOTE ]


What do you mean by "called the BB"? If you put the chips in the pot for the call, and then went back to your stack for the raise that sounds like a string bet. If you said "Call" and then put together the chips for the raise, that sounds like a string bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

I phrased this wrongly. I didn't say "call" and then raise, nor did I put my call into the betting area and then go back for more chips. What I'm saying is that I went to my chips, put the BB "call" in front of me, then put my raise on top, THEN pushed forward all the chips (the call and the raise). I didn't make more than one motion to get my chips into the betting area.

[3rdEye]

[ QUOTE ]
Roberts rules state:
"String raises are not allowed. To protect your right to raise, you should either declare your intention verbally or place the proper amount of chips into the pot. Putting a full bet plus a half-bet or more into the pot is considered to be the same as announcing a raise, and the raise must be completed."

When you say you "called the big blind", I am assuming that you counted out the BB and kept the chips directly in front of you. If that were the case, then I don't think it is a string bet. If you moved the BB amount anywhere towards the center of the table, you may be crossing the line and should have either said "raise" before you did this. Just curious what did everyone else say at the table?
G$

[/ QUOTE ]

Right, that's what I did--I counted out the BB, then added a raise, and then pushed all the chips forward in one motion.

Everyone else agreed that it wasn't a string bet, since I never said, "I call" or anything similar, and since I didn't make more than one motion toward the betting area.

[3rdEye]

[ QUOTE ]
Yep....that's a string bet. You called the BB, that's the end of your action. If you wanted to raise, you should have either put all your chips in at once, the rest of the blind and your raise, or verbally announced that you intended to raise.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well, I did put all my chips in at once. My original post was poorly worded. Please see my replies to others.

[maryfield48]

[ QUOTE ]
I didn't say "call" and then raise, nor did I put my call into the betting area and then go back for more chips. What I'm saying is that I went to my chips, put the BB "call" in front of me, then put my raise on top, THEN pushed forward all the chips (the call and the raise). I didn't make more than one motion to get my chips into the betting area.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well then that doesn't sound like a string bet. But you sure did get sucked out on. Tough luck - you'll get him sooner or later.

[jmark]

To avoid confusion next time with players who don't know what's going on, just say raise before you do anything.

PS What about people who say "I'll call your dollar and raise you a dollar"? It seems like by the letter of the law it would be a string raise, but that just seems dumb. What would happen in a real B&M tourney?

[meep_42]

It would be a call.

Don't use the word "call" or "see" if you're not calling, it's really very simple.

And, for the record, I always announce a raise.

-d

[JrJordan]

The "I see your x and raise y" line is indeed a string bet. The first action spoken takes priority.

[cferejohn]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]


What do you mean by "called the BB"? If you put the chips in the pot for the call, and then went back to your stack for the raise that sounds like a string bet. If you said "Call" and then put together the chips for the raise, that sounds like a string bet.

[/ QUOTE ]

I phrased this wrongly. I didn't say "call" and then raise, nor did I put my call into the betting area and then go back for more chips. What I'm saying is that I went to my chips, put the BB "call" in front of me, then put my raise on top, THEN pushed forward all the chips (the call and the raise). I didn't make more than one motion to get my chips into the betting area.

[/ QUOTE ]

Shouldn't your BB "call" already be in front of you?

It doesn't sound like a string bet to me.

We don't police string bets at my home game (there are only a couple of us who are "serious" players). Frankly, I don't see any reason to. The rule is there to protect from angle shooting, and if someone is going to come and angle shoot my home game, well, that's just sad; we're supposed to be friends.

Now, not all home games are created equal, and some are much more serious than others, and may have many attendees not familiar with each other. If it is just between friends though, why bother with a rule that is meant to ward against angle-shooting jerks?

In a home game, I try to consider the spirit of a rule, rather than the rule itself. The *point* is that no one should get an advantage by "pretending" to call, checking reactions, and then raising if it seems like a good idea. If this sort if thing happens in your home game, fine enforce the rule as written, but just enforcing this kind of nitty rule because "that's how they do it in the card houses" seems, well, nitty...

My 2 cents. Your milage may vary.

[maryfield48]

[ QUOTE ]
We don't police string bets at my home game (there are only a couple of us who are "serious" players). Frankly, I don't see any reason to. The rule is there to protect from angle shooting, and if someone is going to come and angle shoot my home game, well, that's just sad; we're supposed to be friends.

Now, not all home games are created equal, and some are much more serious than others, and may have many attendees not familiar with each other. If it is just between friends though, why bother with a rule that is meant to ward against angle-shooting jerks?

In a home game, I try to consider the spirit of a rule, rather than the rule itself. The *point* is that no one should get an advantage by "pretending" to call, checking reactions, and then raising if it seems like a good idea. If this sort if thing happens in your home game, fine enforce the rule as written, but just enforcing this kind of nitty rule because "that's how they do it in the card houses" seems, well, nitty...

My 2 cents. Your milage may vary.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's very much the way my home game is too. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if I'm the only one in my group that even knows the term "string bet". And occasionally we will get someone who says something like "raise $200 [pause] nah, make it $300". But I've never detected any attempt to use the pause to gauge reactions from the table. So I restrain myself from being too "nitty".

Tell you the truth what ticks me off more than that is the guys who toss some chips at the pot without saying anything at all - and then sit there making someone ask them how much the raise was. Nothing to do with angle shooting - I think it's just a matter of courtesy to say "call" or "raise $X".

Of course, my home game consists of my wife, my Dad, my brother, two brothers-in-law, a sister-in-law, and a couple of other friends going way back. Your mileage will most definitely vary.

[Nate Finch]

I use the rule in my home game to get people into good habits. It's not like it's difficult to say "raise" before you start moving chips, nor is it difficult to say "raise to x". There's a right way and a wrong way, so why not encourage the right way and correct the wrong way?

-Nate