Rough Day At The Office

[onegymrat]

Two hands, 9/18 Commerce. Full table. Game is very loose, slightly aggressive.

1) I open-limp UTG+1 with A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif8 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif. MP (new guy) calls as does LP and the blinds. Five to the flop.

FLOP: 10 /images/graemlins/club.gif8 /images/graemlins/heart.gif4 /images/graemlins/heart.gif

Checked to me, I bet. MP calls and SB (chaser) calls. Three to the turn.

TURN: 6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

SB checks, I bet. Both call. Three to the river.

RIVER: J /images/graemlins/club.gif

SB checks, I check, MP bets. SB calls. I fold.

2) Two limpers to me, I raise in MP1 with K /images/graemlins/heart.gifK /images/graemlins/club.gif. MP2 (LAG) cold-calls. Only limpers call. Four to the flop.

FLOP: A /images/graemlins/heart.gifK /images/graemlins/spade.gif6 /images/graemlins/diamond.gif

Both EP checks. I bet. MP2 raises. EP1 cold-calls. EP2 hesitates and fumbles. While EP2 does this, I jump the gun and I 3-bet and I notice that MP2 is capping the action. The action is stopped by the dealer, because EP2 tries to leave his one bet and fold after seeing the following action. Dealer says he must leave 2 bets on the table to fold. He does so, I 3-bet and MP2 only calls (changes his mind?). EPs call. Four to the turn.

TURN: A /images/graemlins/spade.gif

Checked to me, I bet. MP2 raises. EP1 cries about wanting to see the river for a jackpot hand (he has a wired pair), and stalls. I think about 3-betting. EP1 finally calls. EP2 folds. I only call. Three to the river.

RIVER: 10 /images/graemlins/spade.gif

EP1 checks, I check, MP2 bets. EP1 folds, I call.

Comments appreciated, as well as scolding.

[SossMan]

I don't understand the turn and river calls here. You don't think AQ/AJ are possible? I'm raising here every time. If he has AT on the river, so be it.

[worm33]

How could u not 3 bet the turn especialy with ep1's announcement. Theres one hand that beats u A6. 3 bet

[Nightwish]

Hand 1: I usually fold A8s in that position in an aggressive game, but will sometimes limp with it if game conditions warrant. On the flop, do you think there's a good chance it'll get checked through if you don't bet?

Hand 2: I think it's a mandatory 3-bet on the turn. What are you afraid of? And there's no way I would check the river.

[mike l.]

"9/18 Commerce"

if that's your office youve got issues man. the commerce 15-30 is a much better game rakewise and awful player wise. or if you really want gold try the hp 15.

not 3 betting the turn on the second hand especially when there's a third player in drawing dead is just horrific obviously.

[mikelow]

yeah, and not raising the river on hand two was awful as well.

was he really afraid QJ of spades? Yikes! Maybe A6, but even that isn't that likely.

[onegymrat]

Hi Night,

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 1: I usually fold A8s in that position in an aggressive game, but will sometimes limp with it if game conditions warrant. On the flop, do you think there's a good chance it'll get checked through if you don't bet?

[/ QUOTE ]The game was not overly-aggressive at this point. My choices were in this order and I think it was close: limp, raise, fold. I should have raised, you'll see in my results later. Yes, I think it would have been checked around when I bet. Although, results oriented, MP dude would have bet the flop and I would have been hardpressed to dump it. Betting was really the only way for me to stay in the hand past the flop.

[ QUOTE ]
Hand 2: I think it's a mandatory 3-bet on the turn. What are you afraid of? And there's no way I would check the river.

[/ QUOTE ]I am weak.

[Garland]

Hand #1. I don't like open limping UTG+1 with Axs where x < 10 even in loose games. On the river, SB calling the MP bet is your ticket to fold otherwise I'd call. Good playing.

Hand #2

[ QUOTE ]
While EP2 does this, I jump the gun and I 3-bet

[/ QUOTE ]

Jumping the gun has cost me a lot of bets because of the information I give away and the folds that I get instead of calls. Try to be patient because the way it sounds, you're really excited about your hand, and the vibe you give is enough impression for others to fold...which you don't want with the 2nd nut.

[ QUOTE ]
TURN: A /images/graemlins/spade.gif

Checked to me, I bet. MP2 raises. EP1 cries about wanting to see the river for a jackpot hand (he has a wired pair), and stalls. I think about 3-betting. EP1 finally calls. EP2 folds. I only call. Three to the river.


[/ QUOTE ]

If you have a crying EP1, make him cry some more. It's criminal not to get as much action with your boat as possible. Raise and hope to get a chance to 4-bet!

And by the way, him saying "jackpot hand" implies he probably has some combo of broadway /images/graemlins/spade.gif cards rather than a wired pair.

[ QUOTE ]

RIVER: 10 /images/graemlins/spade.gif

EP1 checks, I check, MP2 bets. EP1 folds, I call.



[/ QUOTE ]

Since you didn't pull the trigger on the turn, you should bet the river and 3 bet his raise and call a 4 bet.

Hmm...since the 10 /images/graemlins/spade.gif appeared on the river I guess the broadway /images/graemlins/spade.gif theory is out. What exactly are the jackpot requirements where you play?

Garland

[onegymrat]

Hi Garland,

[ QUOTE ]
What exactly are the jackpot requirements where you play?

[/ QUOTE ]It's probably a bit different down here. Most casinos have what's called "bad beat" jackpots. If you lose with aces full of anything at Commerce, you receive 60% of the jackpot (20%/winner 20%/tableshare). The crying caller definitely had a wired pair, looking for the third ace on the river so he could have the "aces full" hand. What he doesn't know is that even if the third ace comes, and MP2 has the ace, I would receive the big portion for I have a higher full house. Also, MP2 would need to have a king kicker to play both cards. So many players have lost ridiculous money over chasing jackpots.

Thank you for your analysis. I am weak.

[onegymrat]

Hand #1:
If SB would not have called, I think a call by me was not out of line. MP had K /images/graemlins/heart.gif3 /images/graemlins/heart.gif for a stone-cold bluff. SB had A /images/graemlins/diamond.gifQ /images/graemlins/heart.gif. I'm not sure what he was looking for, but he won the pot with ace-high. I tried to keep a straight face afterwards.

Hand #2:
I knew I was going to get scolded. If I read this post as an outsider, I probably would have advised re-raising the crap out of this hand. But what I kept in mind was that although MP2 was rather loose on the aggressive side, he was not stupid. I didn't play many hands, and had not gotten many callers after me when I raised preflop. He would have 3-bet me preflop with AK, I'm guessing. The only hand that logically beat me was A6. If he were any tighter, I would put him on A10-AQ, but with his style, he definitely had any Ax to call my preflop raise. I felt this was a point (probably statistically incorrect) that calling him down made more sense than jamming the pot with the third-nut full house, for I did fear aces full.

He showed A /images/graemlins/diamond.gif6 /images/graemlins/heart.gif and took the pot.