KK

[Riposte]

PokerStars 0.05/0.10 Hold'em (8 handed) converter (http://www.selachian.com/tools/bisonconverter/hhconverter.cgi)

Preflop: Hero is UTG with K/images/graemlins/club.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
<font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG+1 3-bets</font>, MP1 folds, MP2 folds, CO folds, Button folds, SB calls, BB calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero caps</font>, UTG+1 calls, SB calls, BB calls.

Flop: (16 SB) 4/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/heart.gif, 7/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG+1 3-bets</font>, SB folds, <font color="CC3333">BB caps</font>, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls.

Turn: (13 BB) J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls.

River: (16 BB) A/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(3 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">BB bets</font>, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls.

Final Pot: 19 BB
<font color="green">Main Pot: 19 BB, between Hero, UTG+1 and BB.</font>

[spamuell]

What was your question? You didn't write anything other than copy-pasting the hand history. Was there a specific street you had a problem with? Was it the whole hand? Are you just incredibly lazy?

[Bill Smith]

Looks good to me. The pot is huge and you just have to hope BB is going berserk with A7 or AKs. UTG+1 has QQ and BB most likely has either AA or 77.

[Riposte]

Uhm, I was told that it is best to not address anything in the hand so as not to influence the reader's decisions. Yes, I want to know about the entire hand.

[Riposte]

BB had 46o and UTG+1 had KK. /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[CLC]

I thinbk I would play it the same. Gotta wonder ... gotta see.

[bisonbison]

Riposte, the method of posting is fine. It's a tough hand. I think calling down is probably fine.

[spamuell]

[ QUOTE ]
I was told that it is best to not address anything in the hand so as not to influence the reader's decisions.

[/ QUOTE ]

Fair enough but it's good not to take this too far. I mean you obviously didn't have questions about the pre-flop play because it's pretty clear, it's better to ask specific questions about streets.

Sorry, I shouldn't have bitten your head off, I really wasn't helpful, I am just a little aggravated about numerous things at the moment but that's no excuse. If bison thinks the way you posted the hand is fine then go with him. I am personally more inclined to reply to a post if it looks like the poster has put thought into it and made an effort, rather than just copy-pasting the HH but it appears that others feel differently.

I also find myself that frequently I consider posting a hand and as I write my reasons for my decisions on every street and what I thought my opponents might have had, the correct course of action becomes clear to me and I don't need to post the hand at all.

[crockett]

Wow! I have so much to learn.....
Not the response I expected. I played about 600 hands this weekend and broke even at .10/.20.
But, I can't tell you many times I got busted with the same situation. I don't think I won a single over
pair to two raising psychos....especially with a pair on the board. It happened at least 4 times
where I was raised or reraised preflop...got in a mini raising war with top pair and get to see the villians
set (or trips) on the show down. Those weren't as hard to take as the times they rolled over 35os with a 5 on the board
or something similiar as we see in this example.

Maybe after 40,000 hands...staying to a showdown will make this a positive play. But after my weekeend
experience I'm outta their after my post flop raise is raised and then reraised when a pair is on the board.

It just seems much more logical to save the two BB''s or in some cases more (if you get raised again after
calling on the turn or river) than chase that one elusive K when there is a very good chance that one opponent
holds KK and the other most likely has made trips.

[Riposte]

Well I'm not really chasing another king. I am thinking I am ahead already.

[Bill Smith]

[ QUOTE ]
I can't tell you many times I got busted with the same situation. Maybe after 40,000 hands...staying to a showdown will make this a positive play.

[/ QUOTE ]

The pot being as large as it was, you have to be right only about 1 in 8 times to make staying in profitable. If at any point on the turn or river it they both raised and it was 2 BB to you, I would've folded. For 1 BB on each street, I have to call it. People play too loose and too stupidly for you not to.

[ QUOTE ]
It just seems much more logical to save the two BB''s or in some cases more (if you get raised again after
calling on the turn or river) than chase that one elusive K when there is a very good chance that one opponent
holds KK and the other most likely has made trips.

[/ QUOTE ]

The chances that another opponent was holding exactly KK when you hold KK is very slim. In any case, there was a very good chance you were ahead of UTG+1, so everything came down to BB. To get beat by 64o when it is 3-bets to him preflop tells me he might have been equally aggressive with a lesser hand (like A7) and you were correct to call him down, especially with another player in tow building the pot.

[crockett]

Someone comes out firing on the flop, you raise, your reraised and then the orginal bettor reraises the both of you and your thinking your ahead.....

I'm not telling you that what you did is wrong at all. I don't know anything about this game but I will eventually. I just need someone to explain to me why checking down is the right thing to do.

[MortalNuts]

Well, probably one of two things is happening here:

-- BB called the PF 3-bet with a hand containing a 4, or with 77, and you're behind and drawing very thin, or

-- BB called with any other hand, and is giving possibly excessive action to your "obvious" overpair

The problem is that assuming BB will not 3-bet you on the flop with hands that you beat means you're giving him some credit for being sensible. But if he has you beat, he made what in all likelihood was a terrible PF call, and so is prima facie not sensible. You can't simultaneously think he plays perfectly post-flop but makes senseless, terrible calls PF.

Sure, there's a decent chance you're behind here, because info on later streets tends to be more accurate than info gleaned early in the hand. But surely you'll see say K/images/graemlins/heart.gif Q/images/graemlins/heart.gif often enough here to make calling down fine. Raises on later streets are probably a bad idea, because you're basically never going to get a better hand to fold and might get 3-bet (which would suck). But calling down is fine.

just my 2c.

cheers,

mn