JJ UTG facing a reraise PF

[RustyCJ]

PP $25 NL

I have JJ UTG, I raise to $2, UTG+1 cold calls, folded to the SB who raises to $5.

My stack was about $25 and SB was at $53.

I folded my hand. SB seemed to be fairly tight and had been discussing hands and I read him for a very reasonable player, not the all around typical PP moron.

I figured I was either up against a large PP or AK, either I'm a dog or a coin flip to win.

UTG+1 called the raise, flop came QJ4 and SB showed AA for the win.

comments please? Should I have called his raise?

[sonataarctica]

seems to me like you read him pretty well. if you would have called anyway wouldnt you be kicking yourself "since you had him read"? good lay down.

[JrJordan]

You seem pretty confident in your read of the SB. His raise is not giving you the correct implied odds to draw for the set, so I think the fold is fine. Me thinks you're being results oriented because the set flopped. I'd be thrilled to see SB's AA, knowing my read was right now. Ni han!

[RustyCJ]

I guess I was wondering was I correct in folding, regardless of my read. But with a cold caller to my raise and his reraise, I felt there was a good chance I would have to hit a set to win. An A,K or Q on the flop would be terrifying and even if I did call his $3 raise I might lose alot of money on the flop figuring out I was beat.

[Daann]

When a tight player reraises out of position, especially when it is almost minimum, you have to give him credit for something which is better than JJ. However, I wouldn't go so far to say that it is an obvious fold. If UTG+1 is likely to play and pay off some of his stack, then I would call. However, you have to play for a set, you can't waste money if you flop an overpair.

[turnipmonster]

he raised $5 more or $5 straight ($3 more)? if it's the latter, you have to call the additional $3 getting great implied odds to hit your set. if he raised 5 more to 7 straight then you can fold.

--turnipmonster

[RustyCJ]

I had to call $3 to stay in, I wasn't sure if this is a clear fold or should I call and see if I hit my set and give up if not.

My fold was about 80% due to my read on this guy.

[Leo Bello]

the greatest problem is u were trapped inbetween players. If u called and UTG+1 reraised all-in, what would u have done?
It is a good lay-down. U didn´t have odds, and also there was someone yet to act. Even if u called, you would be always trapped between those two troughtout the hand.

[turnipmonster]

you should call. you are 7.5 to 1 to hit your set and getting 9 to 1 in immediate odds and he'll probably pay you off.

--turnipmonster

[cornell2005]

if you know he has AA, you call. if you think he may have QQ, ect, you may not call sometimes. When he reraises you, you want to play it for set value. The better the hand he has, the more you should play, because your implied odds are higher vs AA than they are against AK, QQ. There are two ways to make a call here: because you think you are ahead, or because you think you have the odds to catch up. Make sure you know which you are dealing with befor eyou act here.

[schwza]

[ QUOTE ]
you should call. you are 7.5 to 1 to hit your set and getting 9 to 1 in immediate odds and he'll probably pay you off.

--turnipmonster

[/ QUOTE ]

i agree. the coldcall-reraise is not very common, so i wouldn't sweat it.

[JrJordan]

I only count $9 in the pot right now, so wouldn't the $3 call give him immediate odds of 3:1? Regarding implied odds, I don't think I'd make this call, even getting 9:1. Certainly you're beating the needed 7.5:1, but you need to take into account the chances that you won't take his whole stack, and that he'll occasionally lose with the set. If he confident that the villain has an overpair, or strictly AA? If it's an overpair, then a flop like xJK, xJA, or xJQ can be brutal. You're not going to get away from it, and will lose occasionally to the higher set. Obviously this doesn't happen very often, but it is important to consider in marginal implied odds situations.

Likewise, there's a pretty good chance he could have QQ or KK. If an overcard flops for one of these pairs, then we'd be hard pressed to get their entire stack. More often than not against a tighty, they'll fold when they face resistance with 2nd pair. This also lowers your implied odds.

The point I'm trying to make is, a lot of factors need to be included other than the 7.5:1 needed to play for the set. That being said, if you KNOW he has AA and no other overpair (a pretty tough assumption), then I'd also call because he'd be hard pressed not to lose his stack.

[Kirkrrr]

I think it's an easy call, especially if you can put him with confidence on pocket AA. Just bear in mind that you're playing strickly for the set, and if you don't hit it on the flop, it's check/fold. If your read was indeed dead on (yours was, and I give you great credit for it, but I think in most situations it's a tough call to put someone that precisely on a hand) and you hit your set, you're golden. If I'm in with JJ pre-flop, hit my set, and still manage to lose for whatever reason, well, I'm just gonna have to lose my money. However, how often is ALL of that realistically going to happen? It's a risk worth taking.

Kirk R.

[turnipmonster]

immediate odds was bad wording, I meant implied odds. sure, it's sort of marginal, but I think calling is +EV. if his opponent won't back his stack with an overpair then that's another good reason to call. keep in mind that you have another player yet to act, and that he might call a raise if you call.

in a capped buyin game like this I am even more inclined to take a small edge if it means doubling up.

--turnipmonster

[Garland]

[ QUOTE ]
comments please? Should I have called his raise?

[/ QUOTE ]

No. Like you said, you're a small favorite against two bigger cards or a huge dog against a bigger pair. If you're trying to spike a set, you only have $25 don't have the sufficient odds.

Only if you suspect the reraiser is very loose would I consider continuing with your stack, and at that point I would push.

Garland

[josie_wales]

Hi,

The BB is .50 right? Thus your raise UTG with JJ to $2 would be 4x BB, or a pretty standard pre-flop raise.

Thus, your (observant) opponents will have you on a range of hands. They will re-raise you if they think they are better than your range of hands.

This makes it tough for you (in many cases) to put him on a hand.

To help with this, I like to raise to 5x-6x the BB with a TT, JJ or or sometimes 99. It doesnt seem like much, but if you raise to 5x-6x the BB and THEN you get re-raised big (was it $5 more or $5 str8?), your decision is easier.

I know that this time you said that you had a read on this particular opponent, but in the future it may be less clear.

A slightly larger raise can help you to gauge a re-raise a little easier.

jw