Ed Miller is my HERO!

[zuluking]

Party Poker 0.50/1 Hold'em (8 handed)

Preflop: Hero is CO with J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif. Hero posts a blind of $0.50.
UTG calls, UTG+1 folds, MP1 calls, MP2 folds, Hero (poster) checks, Button folds, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (5 SB) 7/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, T/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, 6/images/graemlins/heart.gif <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, BB checks, <font color="CC3333">UTG bets</font>, MP1 calls, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, SB calls, BB folds, UTG calls, <font color="CC3333">MP1 3-bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero caps</font>, SB calls $0.50 (All-In), UTG calls, MP1 calls.

Turn: (10 BB) 6/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(4 players, 1 all-in)</font>
UTG checks, <font color="CC3333">MP1 bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">Hero raises</font>, UTG calls, MP1 calls.

River: (16 BB) 3/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(4 players, 1 all-in)</font>
UTG checks, MP1 checks, <font color="CC3333">Hero bets</font>, UTG folds, MP1 calls.

Final Pot: 18 BB

Results in white below: <font color="white">
SB shows 9c Ks (one pair, sixes).
MP1 shows 8h 9s (straight, ten high).
Hero shows Jd Qd (flush, queen high).
Outcome: Hero wins 18 BB. </font>

[btspider]

raise preflop. nice hand.

[zuluking]

[ QUOTE ]
raise preflop. nice hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

First hand at that table, made me leary....translation....chicken $hit.

[btspider]

nah, its not a terrible non-raise. you would want the blinds to fold and buy the button. i just learned this 2 days ago when i posted a similar PF hand.

[kgrad5]

with a hand like jq suited you want the pot multiway so you can get paid off when you hit your hand, i think a raise in this situation is not to make people fold, but to tie people to the pot. a limp is also fine imo.

[cold_cash]

You should raise this preflop, especially after posting.

Otherwise, nicely done.

[btspider]

the hand i was referring to with the PF comments (mostly later):

http://tinyurl.com/56mkj

[chief444]

[ QUOTE ]
You should raise this preflop, especially after posting.


[/ QUOTE ]
Yes. Not raising this pf is definite mistake here.

[kgrad5]

i wasnt disputing the fact that a raise in this situation is a good play, but the raise isnt to make people fold, you want as many people as you can get on your draws and you want them as tied to the pot as possible /images/graemlins/laugh.gif i would love to raise and have everyone call although buying the button is also a plus

[zram21]

[ QUOTE ]
i wasnt disputing the fact that a raise in this situation is a good play, but the raise isnt to make people fold, you want as many people as you can get on your draws and you want them as tied to the pot as possible /images/graemlins/laugh.gif i would love to raise and have everyone call although buying the button is also a plus

[/ QUOTE ]

You would rather the button fold in this situation.

[kgrad5]

as i said, buying the button is a plus, but im just as happy with him calling, when i hit my hand he will just be adding to my profit, especially when he is incorrectly calling 2 cold, every mistake he makes is money in my pocket

[btspider]

[ QUOTE ]
i wasnt disputing the fact that a raise in this situation is a good play, but the raise isnt to make people fold, you want as many people as you can get on your draws and you want them as tied to the pot as possible /images/graemlins/laugh.gif i would love to raise and have everyone call although buying the button is also a plus

[/ QUOTE ]

the raise is definitely to make people fold. you don't have a stellar hand, so you'd prefer the blind $$ to be dead. QJs plays more like a big card hand than a drawing hand when its only 3-way and you have position. if the button cold-calls, then i agree that I'd want the blinds in and be playing for my draws.

[cartoonsoldier]

Ed Miller also says to raise this PF... /images/graemlins/tongue.gif

[kiemo]

It seems you left something out of your post, exactly why is Ed your hero?

[Galilee]

That's not the only thing you left out of your post - why did you waste a bet by posting instead of waiting for the big blind to get to you? I doubt if Ed Miller recommends that ...

[sublime]

Hey zulu

Give some thought to not raising the flop. Not saying that it is wrong, but the pot is not really that big and you would like to keep as many people in as possible.

[sublime]

That's not the only thing you left out of your post - why did you waste a bet by posting instead of waiting for the big blind to get to you? I doubt if Ed Miller recommends that ...

You would be wrong /images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Also, cmon guys all these responses and nobody debates the flop?

[blackaces13]

[ QUOTE ]
That's not the only thing you left out of your post - why did you waste a bet by posting instead of waiting for the big blind to get to you? I doubt if Ed Miller recommends that ...

[/ QUOTE ]

Posting from the CO is fine. At a full table its beter than waiting.

[Galilee]

I guess I shouldn't make assumptions! Apologies for dragging Ed's name into my critical attacks.

[sublime]

I guess I shouldn't make assumptions! Apologies for dragging Ed's name into my critical attacks.

/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Posting from the CO is fine. Some well respected posters actually prefer it.

[Galilee]

'Posting from the CO is fine. At a full table its beter than waiting'

Better from a strategic point of view, or just better fun than watching other people play? I mean, if you want action and excitement, you may as well play every hand and see if you can cap as many pots as possible ... just for the sheer enjoyment, of course!

[dfscott]

[ QUOTE ]
'Posting from the CO is fine. At a full table its beter than waiting'

Better from a strategic point of view, or just better fun than watching other people play? I mean, if you want action and excitement, you may as well play every hand and see if you can cap as many pots as possible ... just for the sheer enjoyment, of course!

[/ QUOTE ]

Posting from the CO at a 10 person table means you're paying 1BB to see 7 hands (or .14BB/hand). Waiting for the BB, you're going to be paying 1.5BB to see 10 (.15BB/hand). Not much difference there. You could probably argue that the cheaper cost of CO posting is probably offset by what you learn about the players by watching (if you really do). In any case, I think you can call it a wash, at least.

But let's look at opportunity costs. If you're earning at a rate of 5BB/100 hands, skipping 7 hands costs you .35BB. Not much, but it equates to taking a 10% pay cut for your first hour of "play."

[Galilee]

'.14BB/hand'

- a bargain!

I'll be looking for tables that I can jump in at the CO now. I don't mind being proved wrong when it's gonna be profitable. (I'm not being sarcastic either - good answer, dfscott)

Alright - you can all get back to discussing the original poster's point now.

[dfscott]

[ QUOTE ]
Posting from the CO at a 10 person table means you're paying 1BB to see 7 hands (or .14BB/hand). Waiting for the BB, you're going to be paying 1.5BB to see 10 (.15BB/hand). Not much difference there. You could probably argue that the cheaper cost of CO posting is probably offset by what you learn about the players by watching (if you really do). In any case, I think you can call it a wash, at least.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm an idiot -- everywhere I said "xBB" in that paragraph, I should've said "xSB". Still doesn't effect the overall equation, though.

[zuluking]

Thanks! for all the responses. Now, I'm UTG with 10 2 o and raise.........

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]
Also, cmon guys all these responses and nobody debates the flop?

[/ QUOTE ]

not I

[Nottom]

[ QUOTE ]
Better from a strategic point of view, or just better fun than watching other people play? I mean, if you want action and excitement, you may as well play every hand and see if you can cap as many pots as possible ... just for the sheer enjoyment, of course!

[/ QUOTE ]

If you have to post only a BB, then you are getting 7 hands for 1BB rather than 10 hands for 1BB+1SB. Add in the fact that you should expect to make money on those extra 7 hands and you see that posting in the CO is a perfectly acceptable (and potentially preferable situation).

Edit: I really need to read the whole thread before responding casue dfscott already said this better than I /images/graemlins/crazy.gif