trying for too much?

here's a hand that I played recently and would be interested to hear advice on:


fairly tight game, 3h3c comes to me in the sb.


3 limpers and I complete. bb checks.


flop comes: 3d Kc 8h


hazaah.

the guy on my left has been making a lot of suspect bets/raises and people have been getting fed up with him and calling him down. So I think I'll let someone, probably him, bet this one then raise on the turn. With no flush or straight draws out there I didn't think I needed to really put a lot of pressure on. I check, it gets checked around.


turn: 3d Kc 8h 3s


how bout that. normally after it getting checked around I'd bet away hoping to be read as a steal and have one or two of those determined souls that call me down when I actually am stealing pay me for a couple bets. However with the 3 pairing and my being in the sb and all I was concerned that I'd appear to have tripped the 3. Plus I expected someone to bluff at it. It'd been happening frequently with paired boards. So I check and it gets checked around.


River: 3d Kc 8h 3s Ad


okay. the A hit. even if someone doesn't have it they've got to bluff at it don't they? so I check and it gets checked around.


so what do the experts think? was I greedy and stupid or just unfortunate that nobody at that table had been eating red meat that day? thanks for the advice.

I'd play it the same way. Unfortunate nobody had anything or was in the mood to steal. If you bet you gte no action anyway. At least you gave them a chnce to bury themselves but nobody was biting this time.

The idea of checkraising the aggressive player on your left is a good. Still, you've got to bet your own hand at some point when he doesn't cooperate.


Maybe if you bet the river somebody will call with 66?

There's something to be said for fear-driven actions. I suspect that those who check flopped sets do so because they fear that everyone will fold. Well, I happen to like it when people fold, doesn't matter when or why. The bigger fear of mine, MUCH bigger, is that I'll check when I would routinely bet, and then I'll end up second guessing myself.


So it's really exactly the same fear, the fear of second-guessing -- "What if I had done the other thing?"


If I bet a set, and they all fold, I feel no remorse at all. If I check, and they all check, I feel great remorse. So in a sense, it's an emotional reason that gets me to bet the set everytime.


Tommy

It seems to me you were trying for too LITTLE!


You need to make a wager every so often, regardless of whether or not you believe you'll get any callers (and every once in a while, even when you think you're beat, of course).


I think you need a "timeout." You have transgressed some unwritten, immutable law.


P.S. If you think a bet might knock everyone out, is check-raising really all that profitable a play? I think you'll find that there's a good chunk of time that you're much more likely to get a call from a drawing hand or a crying call from a weak hand than you are to induce a bluff.

I really favor making a probing bet on the flop in cases like this. Find out if anyone has anything that they like. This will help you play better on later streets. Even if everyone is very weak you may pick up a call or two on the flop from players who want to be absolutely sure they have nothing before folding. By the turn you may well have lost these guys.


If everyone folds, well, those are the breaks.

I agree that the flop was the time to bet.

bet the flop, see what happens. when the 3 pairs, check. maybe now someone will want to take a stab at the pot because:

1) there are now more chips in the pot

2) you have shown 'weakness' by checking

3) the board paired, which is likely to scare weak pairs out.


if you bet and get callers on the flop, check the turn and hope somebody bets. if it checks around, bet the river.


if you bet the flop and get raised, call, and then bet the turn. either way, you've got to get people pissed off when you have the nuts. they won't bet into someone who steals in a lot of these spots, but is now checking.


just my thoughts.

I would've bet the flop. I don't think anyone puts you on a set...more likely they think you have paired up and are protecting your hand. In that case, you're likely to get at least a few callers.


It having been checked around on the flop, I would've played the turn and flop as you did, hoping that someone would take a shot at it and maybe providing me with one or two bets.


Back to battle,


Riker