question about limp vs raise

[smokingrobot]

in a game with fairly predictable players, would you ever raise off the button on hands normally limp-worthy?

such as J10 off suit, or 9,10 off suit?

i guess for my example i wonder about a mid to late limper, with you on the button or right before the button and the blinds still to act pre-flop.

Is it ever wise to raise to feign strength or just limp in with the J10?

I guess partly why i want to think the raise is the best move is to thin the field to make it a heads-up situation since your outs are now limited to mid pair or straight or full house (the latter being a more hopeful outcome) as opposed to the added flush potential of suited cards.

Also, with this raise, if you are re-raised you know you will probably fold depending upon your read of the player (tight, only raises with good cards etc).

Im imaging the scenario in a 3/6 limit game as well.

[cardcounter0]

I think you got the right idea, but you are thinking about the wrong hands. I would raise with something like ATo before JTo. Maybe get a little frisky with KQs and QJs.

I think raising to reduce players with JTo or T9o is wrong. As you point out, the number of outs is limited. I would think you would want a lot of limpers in the pot, so when that straight does hit, you get paid off big time.

I only made about $750 playing 3/6 this weekend, so you might want to listen to more knowledgable posters on this.

[smokingrobot]

No, you're right, i would want more limpers with the J10's or 910's... after reading your post that made much more sense.

your post also points out i might still be playing a little too loose then as well. thanks for the help!

[astroglide]

the odds of flopping a straight draw are ~11%, so if the entire table limps you've got odds for that. the problem is you'll hit problem hands like a pair with your respective weak kicker more often. i would take very few people or everybody, but i wouldn't want much in-between because the odds of domination are so high.

[Akasha]

I may be totally off on this. But I would think that you wouldnt want heads up with 10 J offsuit. The value of that hand is when it hits with a table full of players. Just my limited experience.

[Akasha]

I replied before reading the rest of the thread, and at least I see many agree with me=)

[Michael Davis]

JTo and T9o are rarely worth limping.

-Michael