Do you call pre flop?

[Levi King]

First hand of the night, no reads.

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J/images/graemlins/club.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif. MP2 posts a blind of $5. MP3 posts a blind of $5. CO posts a blind of $5.
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 (poster) raises, MP3 (poster) calls, CO (poster) calls, Button folds, SB calls, Hero ???

[RED_RAIN]

Yes

[Alobar]

yes

[AdamL]

For the "yes" responses -- how come?

[MarkD]

Because you are getting what I like to call "insane pot odds". J6s is more then enough hand to call with here. I'd be willing to call just about any two suited getting 13-1 here.

[Alobar]

[ QUOTE ]
Because you are getting what I like to call "insane pot odds". J6s is more then enough hand to call with here. I'd be willing to call just about any two suited getting 13-1 here.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well he isn't quite 13-1, it could get limp reraised or someone could fold or something. But yeah chances are you are seeing the flop for 13-1, which is good enough to play J6s. If you dont flop the draw or something like 2 pair or trips you fold it.

[Levi King]

Flop: (14 SB) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(7 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP2 raises, MP3 calls, CO folds, SB calls, Hero ???.

Call? Raise?

[MarkL444]

I dont think its such an easy call. The large pot is likely to make you play wrong. You could easily be dominated by JJ or Ax /images/graemlins/club.gif. The only way you should call this is if you have the ability to fold any flop that isnt at least 2 pair or a 4 flush.

[MarkL444]

Call

[Grvnhigh]

You have more than enough hand to threebet for value here.

Edit: I mean, on the flop. Preflop is an automatic call.

[Alobar]

Don't bet into the PF raiser in this spot, you're better off CR raising as it will keep more people in the hand.

You've got enough people to 3 bet here.

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
Flop: (14 SB) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(7 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP2 raises, MP3 calls, CO folds, SB calls, Hero ???.

Call? Raise?

[/ QUOTE ]


do you even need to ask? 4 other people in, and you have a straight and flush draw.

[Joe Tall]

Hi Mark,

You said,
You could easily be dominated by JJ or Ax /images/graemlins/club.gif .

Fearing JJ and Ax /images/graemlins/club.gif when you hold J /images/graemlins/club.gif6 /images/graemlins/club.gif is weak-tight thinking. The likely hood of the two hands you have mentioned has extremely diminished due to the hand you hold.

Our hero has an easy call.

Welcome to the forum,
Joe Tall

[Joe Tall]

You've flopped a great hand and are taking enough opponents to the turn to get value on your draw; maximize your value and 3-bet.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[Ulysses]

I'll go against the flow here. I muck this pre-flop, even getting these odds.

On the flop, 3-bet.

[arkady]

el diablo reads the SS forum?

[bisonbison]

El Diablo siempre esta cerca.

[arkady]

i took 2 years of spanish in 7/8th grade and too lazy to use a translator...

my guess: el diablo is always around?

[Levi King]

I three bet the flop. Here's the entire hand. Bet the turn? Call the river?

Party Poker 5/10 Hold'em (9 handed)

Preflop: Hero is BB with J/images/graemlins/club.gif, 6/images/graemlins/club.gif. MP2 posts a blind of $5. MP3 posts a blind of $5. CO posts a blind of $5.
UTG calls, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, MP2 (poster) raises, MP3 (poster) calls, CO (poster) calls, Button folds, SB calls, Hero calls, UTG calls, UTG+1 calls.

Flop: (14 SB) 3/images/graemlins/club.gif, 7/images/graemlins/spade.gif, 4/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(7 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero bets, UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP2 raises, MP3 calls, CO folds, SB calls, Hero 3-bets, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls, MP3 calls, SB calls.

Turn: (14.50 BB) 4/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, MP2 bets, MP3 folds, SB calls, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls.

River: (18.50 BB) J/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
SB bets, Hero calls, UTG+1 calls, MP2 calls.

Final Pot: 22.50 BB

Results in white below: <font color="white">
SB shows 4s 5h (three of a kind, fours).
Hero shows Jc 6c (two pair, jacks and fours).
UTG+1 shows 7h 6h (two pair, sevens and fours).
MP2 shows 8s 8c (two pair, eights and fours).
Outcome: SB wins 22.50 BB. </font>

[Joe Tall]

Ulysses,

I muck this pre-flop, even getting these odds.

You did read that there was three posters before the late position raise.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[bdk3clash]

I call for sure. Gambool!

I also 3-bet the flop and play for a ginormous pot. I also hope that my 3-bet doesn't make anyone fold on the flop.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
You did read that there was three posters before the late position raise.


[/ QUOTE ]

Yeah.

[Joe Tall]

Wow.

You play tigher than me and even JTG, as I think he calls here.

Peace,
Joe Tall

[RED_RAIN]

Can you give your reasoning on mucking preflop? Even with the odds to call?

The thing that throws me off is you will fold this preflop (fearing a dominating flush draw?), but then 3-bet the flop.

[PokerNoob]

I think SB missed a checkraise on the turn. If one of these characters does have a made straight, he's still got outs. If someone has a boat or gets one on the river, oh well.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
You play tigher than me and even JTG, as I think he calls here.

[/ QUOTE ]

I doubt I play tighter than you two. I quite possibly play tighter than you from the blinds. Suited crap is perhaps one category where I play tighter than many in many positions. Those are the two major differences in my pre-flop approach as compared to Clarky, Ed, etc.

[Ulysses]

[ QUOTE ]
Can you give your reasoning on mucking preflop? Even with the odds to call?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "with odds to call." What are the "odds to call" necessary for J6s? I don't actually know what that exact number is. Please let me know.

[ QUOTE ]
The thing that throws me off is you will fold this preflop (fearing a dominating flush draw?), but then 3-bet the flop.

[/ QUOTE ]

Pre-flop, I don't have a hand. Post-flop, I have a big one.