Two questions on rules

[spickard83]

I play $6-$12 at the Borgata and I was recently informed of two rules that I had never heard of before and I wasn't sure about. Just hoping someone can clarify.

1. The first rule was invoked when in a heads-up showdown, I showed just one of my cards. The other guy threw in his cards, and I was about to do the same and collect my winnings when the dealer flipped over my second card and told me that if you show one, you have to show both. I didn't think this was a rule since I have seen many players flash one card, but those might have been situations where there was no showdown.

2. The second rule never actually came up in play, but I was discussing it with a fellow player at the table. It regards the rule that waives the 4 bet cap in heads-up situations. The guy I spoke with claimed that the rule only applies in situations where the betting round began heads-up, but I had never heard that before.

Thanks in advance to anyone who can clarify the specifics of these rules.

[cardcounter0]

Both rules are pretty much standard and common.

It takes two cards to win. If you have to show your hand for the pot, you must show both cards. If you show one card, the dealer will show the other if you don't. If you show one person your hand, you must show everyone your hand.

The lifting of the number of raise limit is usually defined when two players go to (re:start) the river heads up. Some places don't do this, and lift the limit if a third player folds sometime during the river betting, so it varies by cardroom.

[mostsmooth]

im pretty sure it doesnt have to be the river to remove the cap,can be turn or flop

[jmark]

I believe the reason they make you show both cards to win the pot is to prove you weren't cheating. For example, you are dealt Ac2h but replace the 2h with the As you've been hiding up your sleeve. Then on the flop comes another As since they just switched the decks. You're screwed unless you can show the Ac and muck the As face down.

[highlife]

[ QUOTE ]
1. The first rule was invoked when in a heads-up showdown, I showed just one of my cards. The other guy threw in his cards, and I was about to do the same and collect my winnings when the dealer flipped over my second card and told me that if you show one, you have to show both. I didn't think this was a rule since I have seen many players flash one card, but those might have been situations where there was no showdown.

2. The second rule never actually came up in play, but I was discussing it with a fellow player at the table. It regards the rule that waives the 4 bet cap in heads-up situations. The guy I spoke with claimed that the rule only applies in situations where the betting round began heads-up, but I had never heard that before.

[/ QUOTE ]

1. This is definately the rule, if a player (or players) calls your river bet, he has the right to see both cards. I actually find that move of showing one card after a called bet to be kind of annoying and amatuerish. Now its totally different if you bet and everyone folds, this is not a called bet so you dont have to show your hand, however if you choose to show just one card thats fine.

3. this depends on the card room and the dealer and floor person working at the time, even the casino doesnt seem to have this rule straight from one hand to another. the rooms at AC seem to stick with the rule that the round must start out head to head for no cap to be in affect.

[LetsRock]

1. If it was a showdown (he called you or you called him, then you need to show both cards to collect the pot. IF he did not call your bet, you can usually flash one card if you want - I see this all the time.

2. This rule is specific to each casino. NOst casinos will waive the cap if the betting is heads up. I've never heard that it mattered if the betting round started heads up, but it may be a local rule.

KNOW THE RULES THAT YOU"RE PLAYING UNDER AT ALL TIMES!

[youtalkfunny]

[ QUOTE ]
I've never heard that it mattered if the betting round started heads up...

[/ QUOTE ]

Bob Ciaffone (CardPlayer's "Grumpy Old Man") wrote a great piece about this very situation.

It's three bets to Bob, so he caps it. Everyone folds except the man on Bob's right, who promptly re-raises.

Bob tells the dealer, "He can't raise, it's been capped."

The dealer says, "Unlimited raising heads-up."

Bob asks for the floorman to be called. When he arrives, Bob says, "I put in the third raise, and the dealer announced that was the cap. Was he lying?"

IOW, the number of allowable raises should not change in the middle of a betting round. If more than two players were in the hand at the start of that round, the cap should apply everywhere--local variations should not be allowed.

Back to Question #1: If I'm dealing, I'm not going to turn up your second card, unless someone asks to see it (of course, no one would give a damn about it, until you tried to muck it, which would guarantee that SOMEONE would demand to see it...but that's another story).

Your opponent mucked, you're the only one left holding two cards--that's good enough for me, here's the pot.

[jstnrgrs]

I had an intreasting hand at foxwoods ($4/8)the other day. I get pocket queens in the small blind. one ep linper, and an MP raiser. I make it $12, limper folds. MP makes it $16, I make it $20, MP makes it $24, I call. I called him all the way, and he showed pocket queens for the split pot.

Anyway, the point it that (at foxwoods anyway) the cap is removed when it becomes heads up even before the flop.

[jstnrgrs]

since when they change decks, they use a different color back, I think you'd be screwed anyway.

[SheridanCat]

Check with your room for the actual rules in effect.

[ QUOTE ]
1. The first rule was invoked when in a heads-up showdown, I showed just one of my cards.

[/ QUOTE ]

Unless the room's rules state otherwise, the dealer shouldn't do this. The players can ask to see it, and you should be willing to show it without any animosity. Where I play, it's unusual for anyone to muck if the called opponent has only shown one card; I don't think I've ever seen it. It's the calling player's right to see the hand.

[ QUOTE ]
2. The second rule ... regards the rule that waives the 4 bet cap in heads-up situations.

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Again, this is different in different rooms. In most rooms, you have to begin a round of betting to have the cap removed. Any street, but obviously, when played this way there can never be unlimited raising preflop.

However, I have heard of rooms where the cap is removed as soon as it becomes heads-up. I've never played at such a place, but I believe they exist.

Regards,

T

[slamdunkpro]

[ QUOTE ]
2. The second rule never actually came up in play, but I was discussing it with a fellow player at the table. It regards the rule that waives the 4 bet cap in heads-up situations. The guy I spoke with claimed that the rule only applies in situations where the betting round began heads-up, but I had never heard that before.


[/ QUOTE ]

At the Borgata the cap comes off once it becomes heads up

[HDPM]

But they will change back to the right color eventually. Also, the deck could be wrong by accident because cards are replaced and decks made up etc...

[Randy_Refeld]

The most common rule with unlimited raising heads up allows unlimited raises if it was heads up prior to the betting being capped. In the south they use the older rule that if there were more than 2 players in the hand at the beginning of the round there is a limit on raises.

Randy Refeld

[youtalkfunny]

[ QUOTE ]
The most common rule with unlimited raising heads up allows unlimited raises if it was heads up prior to the betting being capped.

[/ QUOTE ]

I had never heard of this rule.

But I like it!