Steal Raise Question

[The Dude]

Let's say it's folded to you on the button. The blinds seem reasonable in choosing which hands to defend with, and they play somewhat decent post flop. (Meaning you have postflop edge, but not so much you'd like to play any 2 cards.)

Based on the above information above, which of the following hands do you wanto one or both of the blinds to call?

AA-22
AKs-A2s and AKo-A2o
KQs-K2s and KQ-K2o
QJs-Q7s and QJo-QTo
JTs-J8s and JTo

The hands not listed I am assuming are obvious want-them-to-fold hands.

[Steve Giufre]

I never really thought it about it that way, but if you are raising all of the hands you listed on the button you are probably stealing too much.

[The Dude]

It depends on just how tight the blinds are, but probably not.

[Michael Davis]

I don't think very many of those hands have more profitability than the blinds themselves. I would guess that after you go below 99, you don't want any callers. Perhaps with AK-AJs and KQs and maybe a few others, but I suspect this list is a lot smaller than it seems.

-Michael

[Steve Giufre]

Raising Q7s on the button certainly is not gonna show a profit in the long run. Either is K2 offsuit. I don't care how tight/bad/loose the blinds are.

[The Dude]

[ QUOTE ]
Raising Q7s on the button certainly is not gonna show a profit in the long run. Either is K2 offsuit. I don't care how tight/bad/loose the blinds are.

[/ QUOTE ]
That's not true. Especially when you say "I don't care how tight/bad/loose the blinds are."

[Michael Davis]

I agree. I think with a solid table image and the right players in the blinds, raising from the button with any two can be profitable. But, I think there's a chance it might be more profitable from the cutoff.

-Michael

[The Dude]

Sure, there are plenty of variables involved. And I'm certainly not raising every one of these hands every time. But to say they're not profitable long run is wrong. To say "no matter how tight/bad/aggressive" makes the statement absurd.

[The Dude]

BTW, Steve.

Q7s has over 36% equity vs. 2 random hands. So even if you both blinds were going to call every time, raising it is still +EV. That you can sometimes steal and that you can outplay your opponents postflop makes it terrible to fold.

Many of the other hands in my list are not nearly so clear-cut.

[Steve Giufre]

I'm not sure I agree with you. of course if you have two super tight players in the blinds who rarely defend, and they dont play all that well post flop, most all hands are going to show a profit on the button. But when you list K2 offsuit as one of your normal "steal" raise hands, I'm not going to agree with you. That hand is almost always going to be a loser in the long run.

You are correct that I should have worded my other post better. Of course there will be a few spots here and there where a hand like might show a tiny profit.

[astroglide]

equity with aces holds a LOT more water. with Q7s you are outta the ballpark if you get led into on a K64 rainbow flop regardless of what they have. turn would have been an ace or a gutshot maker, river a queen or a finish to your straight. you beat his sixes, but not really.

[The Dude]

[ QUOTE ]
equity with aces holds a LOT more water.

[/ QUOTE ]
Agreed.

[ QUOTE ]
...if you get led into on a K64 rainbow flop regardless of what they have.

[/ QUOTE ]
Ehhhh... maybe, maybe not.