How far should I take this hand?

[Pil Sung Do]

Table is typical (3-6 in a pot) not overly aggressive, UTG+1 is a bit of a loose cannon in that he admitted to trying to buy a pot earlier. Button seems reasonable. BB is very short stacked and not that good. ***EDIT Button is shortstacked and not very good. BB seems reasonable***

Party Poker 2/4 Hold'em (8 handed)

Preflop: Hero is MP2 with 9/images/graemlins/club.gif, 9/images/graemlins/diamond.gif.
UTG folds, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, Hero calls, CO folds, Button calls, SB completes, BB checks.

Flop: (6 SB) 9/images/graemlins/heart.gif, Q/images/graemlins/diamond.gif, K/images/graemlins/diamond.gif <font color="blue">(6 players)</font>
SB checks, <font color="CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG+1 raises</font>, MP1 calls, Hero calls, Button calls, SB folds, BB calls.

Turn: (8 BB) T/images/graemlins/spade.gif <font color="blue">(5 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">BB bets</font>, UTG+1 calls, MP1 folds, Hero calls, Button calls.

River: (12 BB) A/images/graemlins/club.gif <font color="blue">(4 players)</font>
<font color="CC3333">BB bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG+1 raises</font>, Hero folds, Button calls $2 (All-In), <font color="CC3333">BB 3-bets</font>, <font color="CC3333">UTG+1 caps</font>, BB calls.

Final Pot: 20.50 BB
<font color="green">Main Pot: 13.50 BB, between Button, BB and UTG+1.</font>
<font color="green">Pot 2: 7 BB, between BB and UTG+1.</font>

[sthief09]

that's what happens when you slowplay on dangerous boards.

[Pil Sung Do]

that's what happens when you slowplay on dangerous boards

I didn't slowplay. At no point in the hand did I feel I was ahead.

[sthief09]

[ QUOTE ]
that's what happens when you slowplay on dangerous boards

I didn't slowplay. At no point in the hand did I feel I was ahead.

[/ QUOTE ]


you flopped a set and didn't feel you were ahead? that's not good at all.

I think you stopped posting here for too long. you played this hand very weak-tight

[SnakeRat]

You should feel you are ahead on that flop.
If you didn't you should probably muck 99 preflop.

[L0QTiS]

3-betting the flop *may* have given you additional information since if BB and UTG+1 just call your 3-bet you're likely ahead. If either cap, you're probably not and can play the hand accordinly. If the button is willing to cold call three bets, this is also meaningful given your read.

UTG cold calling on the turn tells me he's on a draw, BB could be betting the nut, but just as likly KQ,K9,Q9 , in which case you're still ahead - not sure about the button at this point.

Seems to me there was a chance you were ahead on the turn. Some timely raises on the flop (initially) then the turn (depending on the flop action) may have given you the information necessary to pursue the hand further.

I'd be interested in comments on this or if I'm offbase on my thinking

[MoreWineII]

I'm 3-betting that flop all day long. There's only one hand that beats you here. QQ and KK are unlikely given that nobody raised preflop.

[Pil Sung Do]

I think you stopped posting here for too long. you played this hand very weak-tight

a. That's one of the reasons that I'm back.
b. Thanks for noticing that I was gone.
c. Possibly, I did play weak tight, but look at the flop, and the normal players that play 2/4. I knew that anyone with a J or a T would not let it go and that JT is becoming way too popular.

6 players in the hand, it's been bet and reraised to me. If I'm ahead, I'm vunerable. ah crap....

Ok, if I three bet like I should have, how do you play the turn and river?

[sthief09]

I probably would've called the turn too, and called the 2 bets on the river, then folded after it got capped behind me. there's so many morons at 2/4 that love to bluff raise the river on boards like that. I agree tha tpeople love JT, but that's not enough justification to think that someone has exactly JT when you flopped a set.

[Pil Sung Do]

I agree tha tpeople love JT, but that's not enough justification to think that someone has exactly JT when you flopped a set.

I don't normally see monsters when I flop a big hand. If that flop wasn't so coordinated and so many bets to me, I would have bet and bet again.

FWIW, the BB and UTG+1 split the pot. UTG+1 had J4 /images/graemlins/club.gif
and BB had JTo for a flopped str.

[sthief09]

the great thing about sets is that when you flop one on a scary board and you think you're beat by something other thna a higher set, you still have 7 outs on the flop and 10 on the turn. so even when you're behind a straight, you're still usually in a +EV situation because you'll improve so often, and because your implied odds are so high. JT would give you a ton of action, even on a paired board, and the people with worse draws will keep calling (keep in mind a flush draw is a worse draw because you steal 1 out on the flop and 2 on the turn, which will get you almost unlimited action).

so with a set you've either flopped a monster to which pairs and unpaired cards are (almost) drawing dead, or you've flopped a monster draw if you happen to be behind.

[Pil Sung Do]

So other than not three betting the flop, you think I played the hand ok?

[bdk3clash]

Shouldn't we be 3-betting/capping the flop for value, given:

A) the chance we are actually ahead, and
B) the overlay we're getting on all flop bets given our odds of filling up?

[MAxx]

you have to show more aggression on the flop, to give yourself a chance. ok there is a chance someone has a JT, but by far- most of the time you are ahead. If you get capped ok.... you now have some better info. But hey, you got some outs... if the turn pairs you have a decent shot at a good pot. Turn was a bad card, but if you got the odds you should see river. I would be in looking to fold mode on river if you dont improve and it looks like you are going to have to call multiple bets.

I would say yes, other than not 3betting flop... you played hand fine. But I would have to add that is a pretty big "other than" b/c it is so important to 3bet flop.