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View Full Version : What happened to the big games?


J.A.Sucker
07-15-2004, 04:31 PM
Awhile ago I was playing a little 20-40 at Bay 101 and a few "old timers" were reminiscing about the old lowball days. They talked about games at The Miracle Mile that were huge: 800 limit lowball (in 1972), and of course there were the big games at the Cameo, AJ's, and the like.

Further, they joked about all the bad cheating that went on in these games - Rick Reola and others dealing seconds and such. The live one in my game (who was a live one back then, too) was talking about how he lost X hundreds of thousands of dollars in that game, and I believe him.

I have two questions: First, how could the area have supported such large games, when around here, it's tough to even maintain an 80-160 hold em game? 800 bucks in the 70s was real huge dough. I realize that cardhouses were the only outlet for gambling back then, and those Pai Gow maniacs would probably be pouring cash into the games, but wouldn't they get cleaned out quickly in such a big game with a high skill requirement? They told stories about people paying multiple bets and drawing 3 cards!

Second, how could the two mediocre players (who are not great cardplayers) in my game have survived these conditions back then? They were playing stakes that were probably 200 - 1000 times what they play now, and even though there were some maniacs, the top players and cheats would have to clean them out eventually, right? An extension of this is what happened to these guy's money? Did they not properly adjust to holdem and get broke in the early days? I'm just curious, and this is an interesting cultural point for me; I know there are some folks who remember those games and could enlighten me.

Ray Zee
07-15-2004, 04:46 PM
rich fools were gamblers then. not many left. there were also less games so bigger ones were wanted by the house. the ones that had money left lost it when holdem came in. as time goes on with the rakes and such games get smaller and smaller. and high players that lose seem to get comfortable in those games. tight players that werent good got to last some as there were enough bad players that would pay them off. it was a whole different society in the cardrooms as people were gamblers and bettors rather than entertainment players and theorists. the cheating was rampant as well. really kept you from playing in alot of places if you were in the know. i made a point to be. even then you are a target as you had money. buddy up with mark sherman sometime and he can tellyou some good stories. as he was half in and half out. back in the seventies i played 500/1000 and 1000/2000. and that was real money. now i wouldnt bet ten bucks the sun will rise without first getting a peek.

J_V
07-15-2004, 06:32 PM
Ray, I figure you've got to have better stories than anyone. Can you tell us one good lowball story from the 1000-2000 game?

J.A.Sucker
07-15-2004, 08:44 PM
Thanks for the reply, Ray. Some interesting nuggets, indeed. One question: You wrote that Sherman "was half in and half out." What does this mean? Unfortunately, I haven't seen Sherman around in awhile, but I'll keep an eye out for him. How about the floorman Mike from Montana? He says he used to play quarter quarter PL with you back in the old days. What's his story? Any other characters that are worth talking to?

haakee
07-19-2004, 09:08 PM
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Unfortunately, I haven't seen Sherman around in awhile, but I'll keep an eye out for him.

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Sherman plays exclusively at Garden City. I've been told he's barred from Bay 101. I think I saw him at Garden City a month ago or so (I don't make it over there very frequently these days).

turnipmonster
07-20-2004, 09:08 AM
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He says he used to play quarter quarter PL with you back in the old days.

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that's a big game for "the old days". do they have PL out west? I was always under the impression that mostly y'all west coasters play NL, whereas on the east coast most all of the larger big bet games are PL.

--turnipmonster

theBruiser500
07-20-2004, 12:27 PM
JASucker, please report back here with whatever you find out.

DanS
07-20-2004, 03:07 PM
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Unfortunately, I haven't seen Sherman around in awhile, but I'll keep an eye out for him.

[/ QUOTE ]

Sherman plays exclusively at Garden City. I've been told he's barred from Bay 101. I think I saw him at Garden City a month ago or so (I don't make it over there very frequently these days).

[/ QUOTE ]

I played 8-16 1/2 kill a few times six months or so ago at GC. He came across as a decent (but not stellar) player, but mostly he came across as a grumpy old prick. I'm not sure if it had something to do with a weird repoire he had with some of the dealers, but it didn't seem that he was well-liked. Maybe sort of similiar to Johnny Moss being the live one in the 'Shoe 20-40 game for his twilight years.

Dan